How to get the young excited about aviation?

Roger Roger said:
How many of those are true career jobs outside of the airlines tho?
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almost none anymore - and anything other than strategy, luck, and ruthlessness will net you less than inflation pay increases, no retirement, and • working conditions if you’re not careful

this is a career that eats its young. Kids aren’t dumb, they can see what it’s like, and given the importance of QoL and the people they work with… how many kids would want to be around pilots these days?

make the job better
 
Murdoughnut said:
Someone on one of our FB pages the other day was complaining that more pilots didn't encourage their kids. He thought I was off my rocker when I suggested that I didn't want my kids to fly unless they developed a passion for it independent of me. Otherwise, I'd rather them pursue what they want to do, learn about, etc.

I would absolutely encourage and support them if this is what they wanted to do. But as a hobby to make your dad happy? Too expensive and too much risk.
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exactly where I’m at on it. Exactly.
 
killbilly said:
How to get kids interested in aviation....members of JC who have kids....what do your kids say?
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Over the years ive exposed all of mine to air shows, MSFS, actual sims, and of course $1,000 hamburger rides. I talk some about my work and a little bit of the technical flying portion. They are aware of what it’s like being a pilot.

I’ve never asked if any would like to be a pilot like dad.

I was surprised one day when one of them said he would like to work where I work someday. Since then I’ve worked to help him become more exposed to the training portion of it.

As for the others, like Todd said, why force them into it? If they want to learn I’ll mentor all the way. But if it’s not something they have a interest in, I’m not going to change that.
 
Murdoughnut said:
Someone on one of our FB pages the other day was complaining that more pilots didn't encourage their kids to fly. He thought I was off my rocker when I suggested that I didn't want my kids to fly unless they developed a passion for it independent of me. Otherwise, I'd rather them pursue what they want to do, learn about, etc.
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I’m split on this because I want to balance my encouragement to pursue their interests with the reality that we don’t live in the post-scarcity, AI does all the work and humans just play, make art, and • utopia yet, so we all have to find some way to extract some capital from the machine so we can survive, and being a pilot is still a pretty ok way to do it if you can leap the (mostly monetary) hurdles to enter.
 
CFI A&P said:
In the last few years there has been a tremendous shift in the workforce's priorities - #1 is now QOL. In aviation we used to sacrifice a lot of our own QOL just for the experience of being in aviation. This has come up in several ways with other discussions here, such as the troubles of keeping employees in the airport's food court or concession stands. Why go through the hassles of employee parking, the shuttle or train to go through security just to make the same wage as working at Chili's in the suburban area near home? Same goes for flying, why invest the time and effort in flying lessons and rating after rating when other career paths offer similar results without the $200k student loan or being away from home 12-18 nights per month? The next generation just isn't interested in a career field that starts out with "paying their dues" with low wages and food stamps before making comfortable living. Think of what we've all personally done in our early days in the field and then think if your children, or grandchildren would be interested in that today. I can't help but think about how most pilots portray the industry when asked about it at a party or other social event. Most pilots are grumpy, complain about schedules or "it just isn't fun anymore". Not exactly a great recruiting strategy.

Personally I try my best to recruit or mentor anyone that is interested. I've been very fortunate to be involved in several aspects of aviation and have enjoyed it all. I'm weird and enjoy aviation for work and for recreation. So I do whatever I can to help promote the industry whenever I get a chance to do so.

Maybe the attracting the future generation is through STEM ?
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I’m going to have to disagree with this take. I’m only basing it on my own experience.
1. my parents are self employed (wouldn’t wish that on anyone) great even amazing money, but absolutely insane amount of work. It’s like constantly taking care of a toddler.
2. older brother: he’s in finance… gets done with work, dinner with his family off to his home office, back to some more work and calls.
3. younger brother: finance/ sales department at car dealership.. takes a special kind of person to work in this industry..pretty much one day off a week…
4. my wife: PA, works all day, laptop on the kitchen table, and taking post surgery calls from patients at home.
5. Cousin: orthopedic surgeon, finally started making good money now that he’s approaching 40s. With hospital call, and clinic, pretty much putting in 60ish + hours a week.
5. Me: 15-18 days off a month. Sometimes bid rsv and get 20ish days off a month. I’ll call it what it is, a part time job, and that’s pushing it. Making somewhere between 250/300 because I’m always avoiding work, and could absolutely make more if I’d like. Even thou everyone I mentioned above makes a lot more than I do(except for my wife).. I honestly wouldn’t trade with them any day. Yes the regional days sucked, and I definitely put in my “dues”, I still think this job is the best kept secret.
 
Roger Roger said:
How many of those are true career jobs outside of the airlines tho?
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That’s a valid question that I think varies for each individual. What I considered a career 10 years ago when I was working on my commercial is different than what I’m currently doing and planning on doing the rest of my career. I had no inclination to fly for the airlines because I didn’t want to move to major metropolis to work for one. Then I was exposed to commuting and it made airlines a viable career for myself. My personal outlook changed as I was introduced and experienced the different parts of aviation.

A big portion of career jobs are in airlines just due to the sheer size and number of airlines, along with the visibility of career airlines compared to career 135/91. Even on this site there’s a variety of careers that people enjoy that aren’t airlines.
 
Murdoughnut said:
It's interesting from the airport side of things as well. When I was at TPA they embraced GA and understood what it meant to the overall commercial aviation ecosystem. We sponsored events and airshows and pumped a ton of money into GA compared to many other comparably sized airport systems. It's the reason AOPA has been in Tampa a few times recently.

My next airport absolutely abhorred general aviation, and I was regularly in meetings where the phrase "what can we do to force them out?" was spoken. No 5K on the runway or any of that stuff. I once worked with Southernjets to host a group of plane spotters to come out on the ramp and take photos with a mad dog when they were being retired. Airport gave me no support and threw up a lot of barriers to doing it. I navigated the barriers and held the event, which the airline was thrilled about, and created great social media content. The very next day the VP of operations informed me that he had written a policy to ensure that it would never happen again.
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And that’s where the airlines need to step in and say, this helps OUR business which you depend on.
 
phill1174 said:
This was the same answer I gave the instructor during my first recurrent at brown when he asked me “why don’t younger people want to come here?”.
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I'm sure they do, but they don't have the 10,000 hours large turbine PIC that seems to be required.
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Im a mid-life career switcher pilot. I didn't get my PPL until I was 35. Right now I've got a nice cushy gig flying a Seneca for people I like in a place I like and I'm home every night. Could I make more money almost anywhere else? Absolutely. No question. Is it worth being away from home half the month? Is it worth commuting to BOS or LGA to sit long call reserve for Republic with the hope that sometime years from now I might have the seniority at a decent airline to bid a schedule that doesn't suck? Not really, for me, at this point.

Going directly to a major probably isn't happening for me, and the regionals are a young man's game. So here I am.

Maybe I'll change my mind after a couple more 1000-hour years. Who knows.

Fix
 
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Roger Roger said:
I’m split on this because I want to balance my encouragement to pursue their interests with the reality that we don’t live in the post-scarcity, AI does all the work and humans just play, make art, and • utopia yet, so we all have to find some way to extract some capital from the machine so we can survive, and being a pilot is still a pretty ok way to do it if you can leap the (mostly monetary) hurdles to enter.
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I tell literally every young person that I interact with the same thing, “you have to have a job that pays the rent, so if your true passion is art history or geography or whatever, get your bachelors in it but also have a trade. It can be aircraft mechanic, hvac tech, pilot, or really anything that you can bear doing and afford to get training for provided it pays reasonably well. Regardless, stack the deck in your favor. You might want to be in film, but a lot of other people do too. Go chase your dreams but make sure you can still feed yourself.

The god’s honest truth is that to get a middle class life and study something you’re interested in you are still going to need a multidisciplinary education.
 
Murdoughnut said:
I don't know how Allegiant does it, but I'm one of those who opted not to go into the industry because my family situation isn't conducive to me being gone four days a week, every week. The G4 model of getting pilots home each night is the only flying gig that seems appealing to me on the airline side, but who knows how long that will last. There's no amount of money that really offsets being on the road that much for me.
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Except Allegiant is now doing multi day trips… and treats their pilots abhorrently across the board.
 
Pilot93 said:
Does the AMA need to go out of their way? I’d argue that the average person is more likely to know someone in the medical field compared to the aviation field. If someone wants to be a doctor, I believe it’s easier to know someone in a medical field and talk to them in comparison to talking to someone in aviation about the path to becoming a pilot.
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You can also be a doctor/nurse and be on a whole host of drugs at the same time specifically anti depressants… not the same for being a pilot.
 
Roger Roger said:
To be faiiiirrrr your experience is not exactly typical even of your generation….
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It was an admittedly small window of time where pilots were hired by the majors between 99' and 01' - so it's not representative of my entire generation, but our group that spent 6...7+ years on furlough and bounced around a bunch. Some expats, some left the profession, some made bad choices... our group has pretty close to the same experience that I've had. None of my friends in that boat are encouraging their kids.

I asked my son again.
"Didn't you tell me that when you met Mom you were living in your car and taking showers at the Y?"

"Well yeah but there's more to the story than that.."

"... nah I'm good Dad"

(Attached is a photo of the way he chooses to enjoy flying in our club 172s) [emoji1787][emoji42]
7d5af0d0178cc4a9ed2bb9c8b11a5e94.jpg
 
I think more public and charter schools should offer aviation career programs for kids, especially those just starting middle school. Why not have an afterschool aviation club which would eventually lead to them getting their PPL. The airlines could even sponsor some of the programs and partner with a local flight school or flying club.
 
Roger Roger said:
To be faiiiirrrr your experience is not exactly typical even of your generation….

I know at least one other member here who’s exact opposite, his son doesn’t have a great passion for aviation but has seen how dad has been able to make good $$$, lots of time off, trips to Hawaii etc so he’s going for the airlines despite not really caring about the difference between a Cessna and a Piper.
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I can honestly say that most of the second and third generation pilots, and prospective pilots that I’ve met have grown up in a situation where the parent was well established by the time the offspring came along and they didn’t see or experience a lot of the struggles growing up.
I think it is also a case of having an understanding of the behind the scenes realities through the careers of their parents tends to take the magic out of it.
I don’t come from an aviation family, so once I experienced it I was fascinated by it.
I observed some of the day to day life of the Mechanical Engineering field through my dad and had no interest in it, I know everyone has their own perspectives that help guide their choices in life, but as much as I loved and respected my father I had zero desire to live his work life.
 
SlumTodd_Millionaire said:
That isn’t your problem. It’s your benefit. Scarcity of pilots is good for you. Let the airline industry solve their problem.
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Until you want to fly somewhere.

Salary-wise, I'm at the point of diminishing returns in my non-flying aviation career. Additional money will make me no happier - it'll just turn me into some • with a boat. I'd rather stop getting raises and see my kids have the abundance of opportunities we had coming out college (and be able to buy a house).
 
derg said:
Was talking with some people this evening who do medium and long(er)-range forecasting in terms of staffing and it seems interest in aviation is at a generational low.

From the flying perspective, I still get kids in the cockpit, but I'd say at least half of them are pushed into the cockpit by their parents and just want a photo, whereas the other half have some interest in aviation.

Each organization I've spoken with has more or less echoed the same sentiment that people are generally less jazzed about aviation.

What do we do?

I mean, I know what we DID to make it an unattractive career field for many, but how do we turn the boat around?
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Honestly it’s such a multifaceted problem IMO that besides throwing money at the problem in insane sums I don’t see the problem ever correcting itself.

I think we’ve largely over regulated jobs/commerce, under valued labor that makes stuff or moves the world, and pushed indoctrination over actual education. Our society is to blame for choosing and supporting this whole conundrum IMO… Govt backed student loans have pushed the cost of an education beyond reason, valuing a profession that requires a degree over one that does not, over spending vs religiously saving, profit margins and shareholders over maintaining a thriving company and workforce, valuing cheap food sources instead of long term health, and the list seemingly continues forever.
The profession will always have a high barrier for entry whether it be monetary or aptitude which it should as there are no guard rails/rest stops in the air but then as a young person does their own career risk assessment/ROI modeling it hasn’t and doesn’t currently make sense from a family perspective, a monetary perspective, or a enjoyment viewpoint (I’m looking at you backside of the clock schedules).

The way I see it, and I apologize for this perhaps verbose rambling, a running joke about our profession is that we are largely bus drivers… and now we can’t convince other people to become bus drivers when our employers treat us like low skill workers and the public sees us as nothing more than a greyhound driver…
 
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