Hand Flown RNAV SIDS and STARS
- Thread starter derg
- Start date
DE727UPS
Well-Known Member
Coming out of BFI (very busy airspace) two days ago here is what happened between 1000 and 3000 MSL. Com change to departure. Me asking for flaps 1 and flaps up. A low altitude capture requiring him to push a button and reset a speed bug. A heading change and an altitude change requiring knob twisting and an FMC mod. He was pretty busy and I felt kinda bad. Much of this could have been mitigated if I asked for Autopilot (which is what I will try next time). He's super competent being ex-C141 and was a Capt at UPS prior to the furlough but got downgraded and stayed in the right seat as a super senior F/O. I hardly think he needs to seek another line of work. Just turn the AP on.
There's a time and a place for hand-flying. But too often I've seen copilots find themselves confused, click all the automation off, unbriefed and unannounced, in tight airspace and now I'm changing frequencies, looking for parallel traffic, setting up intercept angles, arming, running a checklist and monitoring the "for the love of David Hassellhoff, TURN! Follow the flight director, we've got converging parallel traffic!"
Time and a place.
Time and a place.
ComplexHiAv8r
Well-Known Member
CA last night hand flew a changed (not original brief) arrival to a PRM ILS approach almost to mins 900 AGL breakout. It wasn't that much more for me as PM, and I'm old...
I'm having more issues with these red eye CA to a mid morning start. First flight has been fun having to keep waking them up for radio calls...
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I'm having more issues with these red eye CA to a mid morning start. First flight has been fun having to keep waking them up for radio calls...
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ClarkGriswold
Non Nutritive Cereal Varnish Engineer
Who is We?You're right - we'll stop looking into it.
Autothrust Blue
”…trusting ze process…”
With some of the stuff I've seen the CRJ autopilot do, especially in the Deuce, I dread my first CAT II.
Another proven recipe for badness.
Jordan93
Well-Known Member
Some of our planes, we can intercept the LOC in white needles and it will auto transfer to green needles. It makes the capture a lot smoother
ComplexHiAv8r
Well-Known Member
Have you done a simulated CAT II ? I've requested my CA to do one about once a month. I agree white needles LOC then green.
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I just learned that today. Apparently about half our planes can auto transfer.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
You will lose the wind data if it does that so any heading correction being held in long range nav will not transfer over to short range nav. It's one of those strange French Canadian things you just have to be aware of.
Jordan93
Well-Known Member
Yes our PQ's can do it. The LOC frequency will also auto tune as long as the approach is loaded in the FMS.
tizzizzailslf04
Well-Known Member
WHAT? This is news to me. I've been here on the CRJ for about 9 months now and I've never seen one of them do this...
KSCessnaDriver
Well-Known Member
Too bad that doesn't help people and their ability to not select NAV off the runway in ATL. It's embarrassing to work at a place that approach has decided isn't capable of being trusted to fly RNAV.
Jordan93
Well-Known Member
Yea I just saw that memo. What's up with that? People aren't verifying the correct runway off the RNAV SIDs?
KSCessnaDriver
Well-Known Member
Who knows what the heck they're doing. Wrong SID, wrong runway leading to the wrong transition, heading mode. The hell if I know, but it's embarrassing, that I do know. Its not like ATL is rocket science.
This thread caused me to hand-fly an RNAV out of ATL the other day, its really not hard at all.
Jordan93
Well-Known Member
Yep. It's part of the before takeoff check. Still gets screwed up apparently.
Just verify you have the cyan needles underlying the white needles (it should be there 30 miles from the runway threshold if the ILS auto tunes or is manually tuned)
And arm the approach when cleared.
At localizer capture it should transfer to green needles automatically.
If the plane auto tuned the ils at 30 miles it should autotransfer white to green with the cyan underneath.
If it doesn't auto tune and you have the approach loaded in the fms then it's probably a heading mode manually switch to green, arm approach airplane.
It's part of the fms 4.1 upgrade that bombardier started offering circa 2011/2012.
Autothrust Blue
”…trusting ze process…”
My silent review as we trundle up is:
Runway, departure, first fix, takeoff data runway block in agreement with the FMS runway and outside, flap value on the takeoff data in agreement with aircraft configuration, thrust mode (TO/FLX) on the data in agreement with the gauges, TO CONFIG OK message posted, runway heading bugged, altitude constraints, airspeed constraints.
Some of this may even become SOP.
Don't even get me started.
Helps if you actually LOOK at the CDU instead of going "26 left SNUFY 10000' bruh"