Horizon pilot union goes to court over bonus

Skåning said:
What do Horizon guys think of AAG acquiring Virgin America?
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Means more feed required...I have a feeling that Skywest will move their AS flying to SFO to feed VX (they have existing 175 base/mx/etc), and QX will fly out of PDX/SEA. I think the biggest sticking point for us is that we are all AAG employees (I have an AS # on my badge, as well as my QX one), and that VX will add 4/5000 new people above us on non-rev/etc. We've been told all this time "You are Alaska too!", only when it's convenient, apparently.
Maximillian_Jenius said:
I have OO pilots and QX pilots as FB friends. I see a lot of name calling in some post. Like calling OO pilots SkyWorst. And calls for jump seat wars on both sides.
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Sounds like some keyboard badasses...Skywest is always welcome on my jumpseat, just know your audience and don't go off saying how awesome your flying is/etc. That's a quick way to earn yourself a stern talking to about tact. (same goes for QX on Skywest JS's...just be cool and don't be an ass (you can totes say that here!))
 
I think the company knows they're going to lose...given that others have tried and failed at this (there is case law for this already). Horizon's already lost arbitration pay once, you'd have thought they'd learned.
 
hook_dupin said:
If ever. A regional just won't get released.

Has any regional airline been released in the last 30 years?
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A regional will pass a DOT impact study in a heartbeat, unless they are doing a large amount of EAS routes. If ANYBODY is going to be released quickly it would be a regional.
 
BobDDuck said:
A regional will pass a DOT impact study in a heartbeat, unless they are doing a large amount of EAS routes. If ANYBODY is going to be released quickly it would be a regional.
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I believe that nobody will be released. Look at Republic's last negotiation round - they kept that going for 9 years.
 
BobDDuck said:
Teamsters.
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Eh. I have absolutely no respect or faith in ALPA at the regional level.

What I've seen so far in my 1+ year at my current place hasn't been perfect, but it has been better in every way than what I saw at the regional level. A lot more trade unionesque and 100% less undercutting one another and then having national parade it around as "industry leading."
 
Screaming_Emu said:
Eh. I have absolutely no respect or faith in ALPA at the regional level.

What I've seen so far in my 1+ year at my current place hasn't been perfect, but it has been better in every way than what I saw at the regional level. A lot more trade unionesque and 100% less undercutting one another and then having national parade it around as "industry leading."
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Having seen how the sausage gets made in regards to the NMB, I can say with absolute certainty that ALPA's relationship with them is way, way, WAY better than the teamsters have.

Don't confuse individual properties with a national resource.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
Eh. I have absolutely no respect or faith in ALPA at the regional level.
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You mean with terms at the regionals like "fly it now, grieve it later" and such.

As much as I hate to say it, SKW is the case study why ALPA is completely ineffective at the regional level. We need a union, but they certainly don't help much.
 
mshunter said:
You mean with terms at the regionals like "fly it now, grieve it later" and such.

As much as I hate to say it, SKW is the case study why ALPA is completely ineffective at the regional level. We need a union, but they certainly don't help much.
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Eh. Things can still get fixed with the fly now, grieve later thing. I'm more disgusted by a couple of things.

1) letting one regional undercut another ALPA carrier in order to get its flying.

2) I would have loved to see national step in early to help un-fornicate the ASA/XJT merger when it was beginning to turn into schlong measuring contest between the two MECs. I think XJT is going to have tough times ahead. While it is mostly due to unwise business decisions by INC, having a unified pilot group might have helped.

3) The ASA and XJT MECs were non communicative, drama filled, and dismissive to what our pilot group wanted. From the sell job on the poop sammich TA to pretending to know what the pilot group needs more than the pilot group...

And yes, having non-union Skywest in the mix doesn't help everyone's cause. Almost every regional out there has had to face "do it for what they do it for, or else.."

Teamsters hasn't been perfect. But my exco communicates A LOT (maybe too much) and there is a lot of talk about supporting other teamsters carriers.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
Eh. Things can still get fixed with the fly now, grieve later thing. I'm more disgusted by a couple of things.

1) letting one regional undercut another ALPA carrier in order to get its flying.

2) I would have loved to see national step in early to help un-fornicate the ASA/XJT merger when it was beginning to turn into schlong measuring contest between the two MECs. I think XJT is going to have tough times ahead. While it is mostly due to unwise business decisions by INC, having a unified pilot group might have helped.

3) The ASA and XJT MECs were non communicative, drama filled, and dismissive to what our pilot group wanted. From the sell job on the poop sammich TA to pretending to know what the pilot group needs more than the pilot group...

And yes, having non-union Skywest in the mix doesn't help everyone's cause. Almost every regional out there has had to face "do it for what they do it for, or else.."

Teamsters hasn't been perfect. But my exco communicates A LOT (maybe too much) and there is a lot of talk about supporting other teamsters carriers.
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I couldn't have said it any better, except for fly now grieve later. If it's against the contract, and you refuse, there should be no discipline.
 
The issue is that when National gets involved, most pilots get angry and feel that big brother is stepping in and overreaching. National is incredibly hands off the inner management of an MEC. Look at the mess that's going on with C44 at Delta right now. Or the backstabby moves at United a few years ago. There are tons of times where individual MECs do something that is not at all in their own groups best interests.

I look at ALPA National as more of a provider of resources than a management group.
 
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