Shots Fired @ FLL

MikeD said:
Say goodbye to guns or ammo in checked baggage. Or calls to make baggage claim as part of the secure area.

Many will say that as reportedly a CCW holder, he should've been the "good guy with the gun".

Senseless tragedy all around.
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Some heads are going to roll at some FBI office as well. Maybe on a "bright" side this will force something to be done about the VA as well, as it seems he's sought help before to no avail.
 
MikeD said:
Say goodbye to guns or ammo in checked baggage. Or calls to make baggage claim as part of the secure area.

Many will say that as reportedly a CCW holder, he should've been the "good guy with the gun".

Senseless tragedy all around.
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Yep...but then the areas outside the baggage claim become major soft targets...


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azmedic said:
Yep...but then the areas outside the baggage claim become major soft targets...
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We know that. But kind of like 9/11, when people demand that *something* be done, all sorts of wild ideas will pop up. Like making the entire airport grounds a secure zone. Anything outside any secure zone will be soft.....just a matter of where.
 
MikeD said:
We know that. But kind of like 9/11, when people demand that *something* be done, all sorts of wild ideas will pop up. Like making the entire airport grounds a secure zone. Anything outside any secure zone will be soft.....just a matter of where.
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Watch someone call for TSA clerks to become sworn LEOs...


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Crop Duster said:
Wow! Surprised to hear that coming from you. Rough day??
First: I think we are jumping a little too quickly to take @ChasenSFO 's assumption that this was the doing of some malcontent at face value and run with it. I'm not saying he's wrong, but we don't really know what happened here, do we??
Second: Man, I wish it were that easy... for many, many folks help is very hard to find. Then there are those who are so bad off they might not even know where to go for help... and that's assuming they know they need it. Psychological pathology is rather pernicious. It affects the organ of reasoning. So asking a person with Psychopathology to use his/her brain rationally to seek help is often akin to asking the guy with a compound fracture of the femur to walk to the emergency room.

BTW, RIP to those who perished.
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???
Psychopathology, is the scientific study, of mental disorders. Specifically related to the cause, and the disease process of mental disorders.
 
Murdoughnut said:
As I've said before, I believe mental health is sometimes a scapegoat. If it were mental health, this type of thing would be commonplace everywhere, as biologically originating mental health issues should distribute homogeneously across populations. For the same reason eating disorders are nearly exclusively an American issue, it's more a function of social constructs than mental health.

The Buddha taught that desire creates unhappiness. We're a culture that wants, wants, wants, because since we were young we were told we could have, have, have. Why have political scientists found that anti-immigrant rhetoric rises as economies fall? Because the more we don't get what we want, the more angry we get, and the more we look for someone to take that anger out on. Kids that shoot school bullies often feel deprived of the social status that others around them have. Timothy McVeigh was unhappy in life and chose to attribute his situation to the government. That guy who went into a gym and shot all of those women took classes on how to pick up women and still failed, and took it out on them. And by some accounts, the Orlando shooter targeted Puerto Riccan men because they had dismissed his advances so many times.

Unfulfilled wants -> anger -> violence. This is in sharp contrast to the Sandy Hook kid who suffered from a diagnosed mental illness, or William Hinkley, or others who had actual diseases you could point to.
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I hope that you realize that everything you explained, IS a mental disorder. More specifically known in the psychiatric bible the DSM, as a behavioral disorder or a personality disorder. The symptoms that you describe sound like diminished capacity, and lack of empathy. More commonly found in any of the Cluster B personality disorder diagnoses. Going with your scenarios, the shooter was recently discharged from the Army for "unsatisfactory performance". That was probably the trigger for his anger and unhappiness and lack of empathy that led him to this conclusion. In a similar fashion to how you describe the shooter, who entered the gym and shot and killed all those women. Because he took the classes as a means to interact with them, and they soundly rejected him. Only this guys target was far more generalized, than specific.
 
Maximillian_Jenius said:
I hope that you realize that everything you explained, IS a mental disorder. More specifically known in the psychiatric bible the DSM, as a behavioral disorder or a personality disorder. The symptoms that you describe sound like diminished capacity, and lack of empathy. More commonly found in any of the Cluster B personality disorder diagnoses. Going with your scenarios, the shooter was recently discharged from the Army for "unsatisfactory performance". That was probably the trigger for his anger and unhappiness and lack of empathy that led him to this conclusion. In a similar fashion to how you describe the shooter, who entered the gym and shot and killed all those women. Because he took the classes as a means to interact with them, and they soundly rejected him. Only this guys target was far more generalized, than specific.
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It would appear that this gentleman had a physiological disorder - I certainly wouldn't argue that from the evidence provided.

But hell, I have diagnosed general anxiety disorder - so technically anything I did could be chalked up to "mental illness". 4 out of 5 of the teachers at my mother's school are on some form of mood altering medication (she's a school nurse and keeps records).

We've gotten overly broad about dishing out diagnoses. Ever noticed that a disproportionately large share of kids from lower socioeconomic homes (i.e. fill them with sugar) are "on the spectrum"?

I appreciate your post - clearly you're knowledgeable on the subject, more so than I. But as a social scientist, I'd argue that there's a distinct gray area between what is a mental disorder emerging from a physiological abnormality, what is a mental disorder falling from a social construct (such as, say, being locked in solitary confinement for years), and what's a mix of both.
 
A Life Aloft said:
Did he have something wrong/some issue with the physiology of his body? I haven't heard that being reported.
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I mean to say a physiologically originating mental disorder - one caused by changes in the body, not just by being frustrated at one's crappy lot in life.
 
Maximillian_Jenius said:
???
Psychopathology, is the scientific study, of mental disorders. Specifically related to the cause, and the disease process of mental disorders.
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Whoops! Stand corrected. Thanks. :) Was thinking along the lines of "A pathology of the psyche", then realized that would still be incorrect. :eek:
 
Groundpounder said:
I don't have time to read this whole thread, how many posts in is the "ban all guns" post?
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You just stoked it!

That's like me saying "Hey! I wonder how many posts we're going to have until I mention my testicles?" :)
 
Derg said:
You just stoked it!

That's like me saying "Hey! I wonder how many posts we're going to have until I mention my testicles?" :)
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Go big or go home.

Rapper-Gold-Testicles-1.jpg
 
Yet another consequence of a guy with serious mental health problems having unfettered access to legal gun ownership.

" Santiago's rambling walk-in interview at the Anchorage office was concerning enough for authorities to take away his gun and order a mental health evaluation. But it wasn't enough to get him mentally adjudicated, which would have prohibited Santiago from owning a gun. "

" Santiago got the gun back a month later when he retrieved the pistol from police headquarters, and it was that weapon, law enforcement sources told CNN, that he used to shoot 11 people Friday at the airport in Fort Lauderdale, Florida. "

" "He hadn't been adjudicated a felon and he hadn't been adjudicated mentally ill," former FBI assistant director and CNN senior law enforcement analyst Tom Fuentes said. "So again, you know we have this situation where he slipped through the cracks." "





What cracks? Guy walks in tells you he's a psycho and leaves his gun and baby in the car, enough to take the gun away from him and order a mental evaluation... but no, was never "mentally adjudicated."

Bullcrap question on gun background check of if you have ever been mentally adjudicated is still a bullcrap question, without any actual effectiveness.

Gotta like how "only" adjudicated felon or adjudicated mentally ill can't legally buy a gun. Phew! Problem solved :rolleyes:

Mass shootings are now just another day in America, and we are desensitized to it by now. :bang:

/rant
 
NickH said:
Not going to happen. After the Nice attack with a truck, even the Seggiest of anti-gun nuts realizes how flawed their arguments were. Real change of opinions happened on the internet. It was glorious!
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That would be a negatory. Most mass shootings in this country aren't terrorist attacks. That's the difference. They happen mostly from your seemingly everyday people who just happened to be mentaly sick / hearing voices / nutjobs who don't get the help they need or is not available, which then leads to them never even having a chance to be mentally adjudicated, which in turn leads that question on the gun background check about as useless as tits on a bull.


Watch this Santiago guy claim an insanity defense. And we can't execute someone who was insane now can we.
 
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