Envoy FO Training

Dexter said:
. You'll make more money and have better QOL if you're on the E175 for the time being..
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Same rate for all 3 fleet types. So actually you get paid less to carry more people if you count it by seats per dollar paid to you.
 
tcco94 said:
How long is the flow to AA right now?
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Please please please take this variable out of your decision on which regional to work for. The flow is not a simple equation. Things have changed over time and I'm sure they will continue to change in positive and negative ways. As a former eaglette, I am rooting for all of my eagle brothers and sisters. They need new hires to improve their quality of life too....but flow, it's so convoluted.

To answer the question though, think it's about 15-year captains flowing (as part of an arbitrated group). (Current Eagle folks may have a better idea)
 
Tld said:
Please please please take this variable out of your decision on which regional to work for. The flow is not a simple equation. Things have changed over time and I'm sure they will continue to change in positive and negative ways. As a former eaglette, I am rooting for all of my eagle brothers and sisters. They need new hires to improve their quality of life too....but flow, it's so convoluted.

To answer the question though, think it's about 15-year captains flowing (as part of an arbitrated group). (Current Eagle folks may have a better idea)
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No worries I'm not interested in their program or that flow but I have many colleagues who worship the "5 year AA flow" they preach as they've signed their life away already.

Just curious to what the truth was from what they recruit it as.
 
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tcco94 said:
No worries I'm not interested in their program or that flow but I have many colleagues who worship the "5 year AA flow" they preach as they've signed their life away already.

Just curious to what the truth was from what they recruit it as.
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The truth lies somewhere between what the recruiters are saying and what current pilots are flowing at.

Clear as mud.
 
I have many friends who moved to fly for companies like Piedmont and fly the Dash because they will be at AA in 3 years....... Denial is strong these days.
I also have people who have less than 1k total tell me that if Spirit called tomorrow they would decline because Delta will be calling in 6 mo's. DUH-FAQ is wrong with people now days???
 
CFIscare said:
The truth lies somewhere between what the recruiters are saying and what current pilots are flowing at.

Clear as mud.
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I don't have access to what the current pilots are flowing at though. The recruiters state 5 years clear as mud. They typically remind me of someone who's running a pyramid scheme trying to get you to join.


I never trusted the 5 years. I thought I read here months ago that it was 8 or 9 years but wasn't sure if that number is getting better or worse.
 
tcco94 said:
I don't have access to what the current pilots are flowing at though. The recruiters state 5 years clear as mud. They typically remind me of someone who's running a pyramid scheme trying to get you to join.


I never trusted the 5 years. I thought I read here months ago that it was 8 or 9 years but wasn't sure if that number is getting better or worse.
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I don't have access to the flows anymore, but if I had to take a guess, I would say the current flows are in the 16 year range. Just a guess though. Hopefully a current Envoy guy can ring in with a more accurate number for you.
 
Well, i'm almost at 10 years now with Envoy and I still have another 2 years to flow (I predict). That means the flow will be at 12 years... 2 years from now.
 
subpilot said:
Well, i'm almost at 10 years now with Envoy and I still have another 2 years to flow (I predict). That means the flow will be at 12 years... 2 years from now.
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If flow is at 12 years...What's upgrade at? They advertise 2 1/2 years
 
Maximillian_Jenius said:
Also I continue to read that due to Compasses quality of training, they're pilots are in very high demand with the legacies.
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Beep said:
They just posted a vacancy bid for ORD 175 today. Also, as FOs we can be displaced from one type of aircraft to another, but we can't bid for another aircraft unless it is for captain upgrade.
So it looks like we'll find out how many spots are open in ORD on it after the bid closes, I'm sure there will be a few DFW 175 people that will opt for Chicago.
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So the 175s are confirmed ORD? Last rumor I heard was that they were still looking at MIA
 
ORD has the 175, CRJ700, and 145. DFW has the 145 and 175.

While I have a healthy skepticism about the flow, there are hundreds of pilots from Envoy who either couldn't or didn't try to get hired at a major, and are now sitting pretty at AA.

I'm not telling you to believe a 100% in the flow, but people that say how with retirements everyone will end up at our favorite airline aren't doing justice to how competitive it is to get hired.

Don't think just because you have 1000 TPIC at whatever quick upgrade airline of the month is, the legacies are going to start kicking down your door.

The flow doesn't keep you at Envoy, feel free to go out and get hired at any airline of your choosing before flow.
 
EastBay said:
The flow doesn't keep you at Envoy, feel free to go out and get hired at any airline of your choosing before flow.
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Yeah but some people are signing flow at ages of 18-23 years old because they're being told in 5 years they'll be sitting pretty in an A320/787/etc.

What holds you from going to Envoy (not flow) and then having more options when you get your time?
 
If I were picking a regional to apply to I would focus first on the ability to live in base. Secondly I would look at pay scales and compensation. Upgrade times would be third on my list of priorities. In a few years, when mainline hiring hits full throttle, flows won't matter as much.

I lived in DFW or ORD, I would go to Envoy. With the bonus, the pay scale is competitive, upgrade times will drop over the next few years, and the flow is a nice card to keep in your back pocket.


I seriously considered jumping from Mesa to Envoy back in March, but I would loose so much QOL that I changed my mind. When I was hired at Mesa, our pay scale was only slightly behind the other regionals. Today Mesa is only paying 60% of what the industry average 1st yr FO earns. Till that gets fixed, I wouldn't recommend anyone come to Mesa.
 
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