The Power of No; Difficult Decision Making

Great write up!!
These situations are the very reason I'm no longer at my last job. One of the best decisions I've made in a long time!

@KLB wish we could have flown together again but things worked out for the best for BOTH of us.
 
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I had a chief pilot at my commuter tell me the hydraulic leak that dropped from 85%-15% was fine and because the leak couldn't be found, it was fine to fill it up and fly back. Oh, and "if you were losing oil in a car you wouldn't rebuild the engine" (direct quote). Eventually I prodded the on-call mx to take the cowl off and sure enough there was the missing fluid sitting at the bottom of the cowl. We spent the night, day 5 of 4. The CP is at United now.

You'd think things have changed but they still push us whether it's flying a clapped out Seneca or a new Airbus.
 
I know both bosses in that article, and the responses from them doesn't surprise me at all. The guy at Amflight was a monster, and the chief at the regional is a good guy who line pilots respect.
 
wheelsup said:
I had a chief pilot at my commuter tell me the hydraulic leak that dropped from 85%-15% was fine and because the leak couldn't be found, it was fine to fill it up and fly back. Oh, and "if you were losing oil in a car you wouldn't rebuild the engine" (direct quote). Eventually I prodded the on-call mx to take the cowl off and sure enough there was the missing fluid sitting at the bottom of the cowl. We spent the night, day 5 of 4. The CP is at United now.

You'd think things have changed but they still push us whether it's flying a clapped out Seneca or a new Airbus.
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I found a brown spot in the snow below an engine in some upstate NY town. Ramper asked what I was looking at, I told him I think it's oil. He said "nah, I think someone poured out the coffee there last night." I was skeptical and told the CA, so we called out MX.

Ramp got to him first and got it in his mind that it was coffee. Was written up that way and off we went. Got to IAD, did the walk around, everything looked fine. Went inside for a bit, decided to take a look when I came back. Another puddle under the engine. Call MX out, he says it's nothing. I ask him if he could at least pop the cowl to look closer, he decides to do a full engine run/leak check. Turns out the oil line to the low pressure sensor was loose and leaking.

I heart ASAP.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
I found a brown spot in the snow below an engine in some upstate NY town. Ramper asked what I was looking at, I told him I think it's oil. He said "nah, I think someone poured out the coffee there last night." I was skeptical and told the CA, so we called out MX.

Ramp got to him first and got it in his mind that it was coffee. Was written up that way and off we went. Got to IAD, did the walk around, everything looked fine. Went inside for a bit, decided to take a look when I came back. Another puddle under the engine. Call MX out, he says it's nothing. I ask him if he could at least pop the cowl to look closer, he decides to do a full engine run/leak check. Turns out the oil line to the low pressure sensor was loose and leaking.

I heart ASAP.
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I would've at least felt it. Not sure what type of coffee that ramper drinks, but most coffee doesn't feel, smell, or taste like oil. Second, who wrote it in the logbook as coffee?
 
Cptnchia said:
I would've at least felt it. Not sure what type of coffee that ramper drinks, but most coffee doesn't feel, smell, or taste like oil. Second, who wrote it in the logbook as coffee?
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Yeah, feeling and smelling the drip (giggity) has more than once kept me from panicking about a perfectly good airplane, and also found some pretty serious problems.
 
Cptnchia said:
I would've at least felt it. Not sure what type of coffee that ramper drinks, but most coffee doesn't feel, smell, or taste like oil. Second, who wrote it in the logbook as coffee?
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The mechanic claims to have smelt it. He also is the one that stated it was coffee in the logbook. We wrote it up as "brown puddle under engine cowl, suspected to be oil." He wrote "upon further inspection, found to be coffee."

Was talking to one of our safety guys a bit later. "Oh, that was you? Yeah, that company doesn't do maintenance for us up there anymore."
 
Screaming_Emu said:
The mechanic claims to have smelt it. He also is the one that stated it was coffee in the logbook. We wrote it up as "brown puddle under engine cowl, suspected to be oil." He wrote "upon further inspection, found to be coffee."

Was talking to one of our safety guys a bit later. "Oh, that was you? Yeah, that company doesn't do maintenance for us up there anymore."
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As a mechanic, that gives me the sads. If you can't tell turbine oil from coffee, you shouldn't be working on a lawnmower let alone a jet airplane.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
The mechanic claims to have smelt it. He also is the one that stated it was coffee in the logbook. We wrote it up as "brown puddle under engine cowl, suspected to be oil." He wrote "upon further inspection, found to be coffee."

Was talking to one of our safety guys a bit later. "Oh, that was you? Yeah, that company doesn't do maintenance for us up there anymore."
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The unfortunate thing about the whole episode is they threw the contractor under the bus. You've met those guys, most of the time they have no clue how to work on our airplanes and just use a printed instruction sheet and "guidance" from mx control. MX control are the big pushers, everyone else pales in comparison to those thugs, and yes I do mean thugs. They got their departure completion out of that contractor, threw him under the bus, and moved on to the next place they can exercise full control over. The first time a contractor tells a mx controller "no" on his own (ie the pilots aren't pushing back) is the last time they will work for them, and that has significant ramifications on the contractors' employer.
 
wheelsup said:
The unfortunate thing about the whole episode is they threw the contractor under the bus. You've met those guys, most of the time they have no clue how to work on our airplanes and just use a printed instruction sheet and "guidance" from mx control. MX control are the big pushers, everyone else pales in comparison to those thugs, and yes I do mean thugs. They got their departure completion out of that contractor, threw him under the bus, and moved on to the next place they can exercise full control over. The first time a contractor tells a mx controller "no" on his own (ie the pilots aren't pushing back) is the last time they will work for them, and that has significant ramifications on the contractors' employer.
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I dunno, I actually had the opposite be true at my old shop. Yeah, MX control are big pushers, but I also had quite a few guys tell MX control to pound sand and they weren't going to put their signature on something. Company mechanics were much more likely to go along with it.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
I dunno, I actually had the opposite be true at my old shop. Yeah, MX control are big pushers, but I also had quite a few guys tell MX control to pound sand and they weren't going to put their signature on something. Company mechanics were much more likely to go along with it.
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That's good to hear
 
wheelsup said:
The unfortunate thing about the whole episode is they threw the contractor under the bus. You've met those guys, most of the time they have no clue how to work on our airplanes and just use a printed instruction sheet and "guidance" from mx control. MX control are the big pushers, everyone else pales in comparison to those thugs, and yes I do mean thugs. They got their departure completion out of that contractor, threw him under the bus, and moved on to the next place they can exercise full control over. The first time a contractor tells a mx controller "no" on his own (ie the pilots aren't pushing back) is the last time they will work for them, and that has significant ramifications on the contractors' employer.
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I sit next to MX ctrl everyday in dispatch. I have found them to be as safety and legality driven as any other employee in the OCC. I think they do fantastic work, and the ones I've met all seem to take the responsibility of their job, and the lives of the passengers on board extremely seriously.
 
Luigi said:
I sit next to MX ctrl everyday in dispatch. I have found them to be as safety and legality driven as any other employee in the OCC. I think they do fantastic work, and the ones I've met all seem to take the responsibility of their job, and the lives of the passengers on board extremely seriously.
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I obviously didn't work for the same company that you do.
 
There is also the flip side of the coin, Pilots that write up airworthy aircraft to suit their schedule or desires. It's amazing how many airplanes break in vacation spots or the day before Christmas and Thanksgiving and the squawks can't be duplicated. I had an air ambulance pilot from Scottsdale write up his lear every time he came to KVNY, coincidentally his girlfriend lived in Santa Monica.
 
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