Spirit MEC shenanigans
- Thread starter Cruise
- Start date
amorris311
Well-Known Member
Ethan for the win!
Seggy
Well-Known Member
That is fake as the Dennis Quaid video.
Nick
Well-Known Member
Regardless, I had to watch it 30-40 times.
HRDiva
Well-Known Member
Here is what I posted on our Spirit Pilot Wives group and called out the wife of one of the FLL reps who orchestrated this:
"OK, I still don't understand why it happened. It seems like the new "leadership" is not transparent. There is talk of wide support for what happened but no one we know had a clue.
If the new "leadership" sells out and gives in to pref bidding, gives up the 4-5 days off, transition conflicts and all the other qol areas to placate the 26% and bring back the 150%, then you have all lost. We only have 2 years left, but care about the rest of you. And it would have been nice to finish out with decent pay (since newbies have no idea about how bad it was for FO's prior to 2010). He made $70.50/hr as an 9 year FO (yes there were no fast upgrades for those hired 8/27/2001).
I met P H several times in 2010. He is so dedicated and smart. You don't get much better than that. But he's tossed aside. Stupid in our opinion. It's clear that the agenda is to replace the NC. Stupid. This is a power grab and has nothing to do with negotiations. But it has been made to be.
DH is afraid in negotiations, they will eat our lunch. Please share this Ashley. Don't sell out to the few vocal single issue individuals on the Internet who are not the silent majority of pilots. Ford & Harrison will rip your intestines out."
"OK, I still don't understand why it happened. It seems like the new "leadership" is not transparent. There is talk of wide support for what happened but no one we know had a clue.
If the new "leadership" sells out and gives in to pref bidding, gives up the 4-5 days off, transition conflicts and all the other qol areas to placate the 26% and bring back the 150%, then you have all lost. We only have 2 years left, but care about the rest of you. And it would have been nice to finish out with decent pay (since newbies have no idea about how bad it was for FO's prior to 2010). He made $70.50/hr as an 9 year FO (yes there were no fast upgrades for those hired 8/27/2001).
I met P H several times in 2010. He is so dedicated and smart. You don't get much better than that. But he's tossed aside. Stupid in our opinion. It's clear that the agenda is to replace the NC. Stupid. This is a power grab and has nothing to do with negotiations. But it has been made to be.
DH is afraid in negotiations, they will eat our lunch. Please share this Ashley. Don't sell out to the few vocal single issue individuals on the Internet who are not the silent majority of pilots. Ford & Harrison will rip your intestines out."
surreal1221
Well-Known Member
I have more than 4-5 days off with PrefBid, and transition conflicts are the line bidders crutch ((#PBSPROTIP: If you spend enough time to figure out how to bid, you know how to still get the same similar sort of schedule...WITH LESS WORK!!?!?!?!? What a deal!!)) [[I'll let some of you figure that one out...but PBS itself is not the problem, its the contract language that accompanies it...oops...guess I let the answer out of the bag...]]
Carry on...Spirit Problem is a Spirit Problem.
BUT! If the Association is so afraid of PBS, then well, that kinda shows that no one wants to take the leadership role to make it truly work for their pilots and are willing to roll over and allow the company to set the terms and conditions, contrary to how a very successful pilot group established PBS - but alas, that pilot group flies RJs around instead of Airbii.
Carry on...Spirit Problem is a Spirit Problem.
BUT! If the Association is so afraid of PBS, then well, that kinda shows that no one wants to take the leadership role to make it truly work for their pilots and are willing to roll over and allow the company to set the terms and conditions, contrary to how a very successful pilot group established PBS - but alas, that pilot group flies RJs around instead of Airbii.
Eagle421flyer
Well-Known Member
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
This was posted on APC.........
This is a narrative of what happened at the recent Spirit MEC meeting that resulted in the recall of Chris Amongero and Paul Hopkins:
The recall was not on the advance agenda however there was another agenda item that had a great deal of significance. That item was a confidentiality agreement for the MEC members to sign, a little more about that later.
The meeting was started and shortly after the start, a new agenda item was added which was the recall of Chris and Paul. Of the six voting members on the MEC only Paul Degrenier and Todd Hirshon opposed it. Obviously they were outvoted by the status representatives from Councils 77 and 109 so the item was added. At this point it is very important to read the first few words of the Fast Read announcing the recall “After much consideration”.
Ackerman and Leonard made several comments about wanting to be more transparent with the Spirit pilots and when ask later in the meeting why they were recalling two of the highest MEC positions, they only responded with we want to go another direction with no specifics given.
So now the recall is on the floor and the MEC decides to go into closed session. The Committee members present as well as the attending pilots left the room. Within 20 minutes of the closed session beginning, both Paul and Chris exited the meeting room because they had been recalled. The Council 77 and 109 representatives voted in favor of the recall while the Council 18 representatives voted against it.
Here is the strange thing, prior to any vote there is a discussion. When Todd Hirshon attempted to talk about the issue he was basically told to be quiet because the Council 77 and 109 representatives had already decided to recall both of them. How is that for objectivity???
There had been a number of rumors about one of the status representatives recording phone conversations with the members he talked to. In addition there was another rumor that Ackerman had turned pilots over to Spirit HR and the Chief Pilot’s Office, for disciplinary action, regarding disagreements those pilots had with the newly elected status representatives of Council 77 and/or 109 which were recorded. Here is a portion of Ackerman’s email: “I am deeply troubled to learn that at least two-me included-of our status reps have been intimidated and threatened by pilots on issues from everything including recall of officers, social media, and the council 109 resolution. This is illegal, immoral and this nonsense stops right now. I have reached out to Spirit HR, the chief pilot’s office and ALPA Legal. This behavior is unconscionable.” He also writes ”Pilots that want to engage in a smear campaign-threaten-intimidate–and other illegal actions put themselves at serious risk for their jobs and livelihood.” He further writes “I’m doing my part and willing to address anyone or anything that stands in my way of doing the very best thing-short and long term- for the Spirit Pilot”.
When Ackerman and Leonard were asked directly what were the treats, they both responded with something along the line of I don’t remember.
Having shown you that, we turn to the open session of the MEC meeting, which included questions from the pilots attending: Jason Leonard was asked if he recorded phone calls from Spirit Pilots his response was yes. He was then asked if those recordings were shared with anyone else, his response was no. He was then asked if he still had the phone recordings and his answer was no, he had deleted them. He was then asked if he remembered a phone conversation with a specific member and he answered yes. It is unconscionable that an elected status rep would secretly record phone conversations with other members, this not only unconscionable but illegal in the state of Florida. Would you like to be represented at a Disciplinary Meeting with the Company by this guy???
Now we turn to the questions directed to James Ackerman: He was asked if he had recently turned in member/s into the Chief Pilot’s office, he responded yes. Everyone in my immediate vicinity gasp in disbelief. This man just admitted he turned one, or more, of our members into Spirit Management which could “put themselves at serious risk for their jobs and livelihood.”
In the Fast Read sent out 4/15/2015 it stated “The new MEC Chairman, James Ackerman, comes with extensive ALPA experience. He has worked in the role of MEC chairman, Negotiating Committee and as a shop steward on a Teamsters property.” With all of this wealth of experience why did he turn the pilot/s over to the Company instead of our own Professional Standards Committee????
This is clearly an Article 8 (expulsion from ALPA) event. James Ackerman is a status rep for Council 77, anyone want him to represent them knowing he may divulge information shared with him assuming it was confidential???
Now, let’s go back to the Confidentiality agreement that was on the agenda. I won’t mention any names but Chris, Paul Hopkins, Sean Creed, Paul Degrenier and Todd had suspected there was someone on the MEC that has close ties to the Chief Pilot’s Office. This suspicion stemmed from information the Company knew that had only been talked about in the MEC meetings. It was very apparent to Chris, Paul Hopkins, Sean Creed, Paul Degrenier and Todd Hirshon there was a company mole on the MEC. This was the reason for the confidentiality agreement…..to attempt to silence the mole.
After the recall of Chris and Paul, Todd Hirshon, who authored the agenda item, decided to withdraw it so the events could be transparent to the Spirit Pilots.
I believe our current MEC is compromised by the Council 77 and 109 representatives and cannot be trusted.
On the other side, Chris Amongero stepped up to replace Sean Creed as MEC Chairman and immediately engaged Spirit’s Management. He has given his energy, personal time and talents to defend our contract and keep Spirit’s Management from rolling over us.
Paul Hopkins was the Strategic Planning Coordinator before, during and after our strike of almost 5 years ago. His father was the author of “Flying the Line” (vol. 1 & 2). Because of our successful strike Paul was loaned to the ALPA National Strategic Planning Committee. Sean Creed led our pilots and the MEC in our most desperate times leading up to the strike. He was able to guide the LEC members and manage all of the other committees not directly connected to the strike preparedness. Sean and Andy Nelson oversaw the Negotiating Committee and let them develop the strategies that gave us our quality of life issue in our current CBA.
So there you have it, we now have an MEC Chairman who turned over pilots to spirit management that could “put themselves at serious risk for their jobs and livelihood”, and he apparently was the principle in orchestrating the covert recall of Chris and Paul. We have another status representative who records phone conversations with our members. Then we have one of the status representatives who apparently leaks MEC business to Spirit Management.
It would appear we have a real mess on our hands at the MEC level…..what are you going to do about it???
This is a narrative of what happened at the recent Spirit MEC meeting that resulted in the recall of Chris Amongero and Paul Hopkins:
The recall was not on the advance agenda however there was another agenda item that had a great deal of significance. That item was a confidentiality agreement for the MEC members to sign, a little more about that later.
The meeting was started and shortly after the start, a new agenda item was added which was the recall of Chris and Paul. Of the six voting members on the MEC only Paul Degrenier and Todd Hirshon opposed it. Obviously they were outvoted by the status representatives from Councils 77 and 109 so the item was added. At this point it is very important to read the first few words of the Fast Read announcing the recall “After much consideration”.
Ackerman and Leonard made several comments about wanting to be more transparent with the Spirit pilots and when ask later in the meeting why they were recalling two of the highest MEC positions, they only responded with we want to go another direction with no specifics given.
So now the recall is on the floor and the MEC decides to go into closed session. The Committee members present as well as the attending pilots left the room. Within 20 minutes of the closed session beginning, both Paul and Chris exited the meeting room because they had been recalled. The Council 77 and 109 representatives voted in favor of the recall while the Council 18 representatives voted against it.
Here is the strange thing, prior to any vote there is a discussion. When Todd Hirshon attempted to talk about the issue he was basically told to be quiet because the Council 77 and 109 representatives had already decided to recall both of them. How is that for objectivity???
There had been a number of rumors about one of the status representatives recording phone conversations with the members he talked to. In addition there was another rumor that Ackerman had turned pilots over to Spirit HR and the Chief Pilot’s Office, for disciplinary action, regarding disagreements those pilots had with the newly elected status representatives of Council 77 and/or 109 which were recorded. Here is a portion of Ackerman’s email: “I am deeply troubled to learn that at least two-me included-of our status reps have been intimidated and threatened by pilots on issues from everything including recall of officers, social media, and the council 109 resolution. This is illegal, immoral and this nonsense stops right now. I have reached out to Spirit HR, the chief pilot’s office and ALPA Legal. This behavior is unconscionable.” He also writes ”Pilots that want to engage in a smear campaign-threaten-intimidate–and other illegal actions put themselves at serious risk for their jobs and livelihood.” He further writes “I’m doing my part and willing to address anyone or anything that stands in my way of doing the very best thing-short and long term- for the Spirit Pilot”.
When Ackerman and Leonard were asked directly what were the treats, they both responded with something along the line of I don’t remember.
Having shown you that, we turn to the open session of the MEC meeting, which included questions from the pilots attending: Jason Leonard was asked if he recorded phone calls from Spirit Pilots his response was yes. He was then asked if those recordings were shared with anyone else, his response was no. He was then asked if he still had the phone recordings and his answer was no, he had deleted them. He was then asked if he remembered a phone conversation with a specific member and he answered yes. It is unconscionable that an elected status rep would secretly record phone conversations with other members, this not only unconscionable but illegal in the state of Florida. Would you like to be represented at a Disciplinary Meeting with the Company by this guy???
Now we turn to the questions directed to James Ackerman: He was asked if he had recently turned in member/s into the Chief Pilot’s office, he responded yes. Everyone in my immediate vicinity gasp in disbelief. This man just admitted he turned one, or more, of our members into Spirit Management which could “put themselves at serious risk for their jobs and livelihood.”
In the Fast Read sent out 4/15/2015 it stated “The new MEC Chairman, James Ackerman, comes with extensive ALPA experience. He has worked in the role of MEC chairman, Negotiating Committee and as a shop steward on a Teamsters property.” With all of this wealth of experience why did he turn the pilot/s over to the Company instead of our own Professional Standards Committee????
This is clearly an Article 8 (expulsion from ALPA) event. James Ackerman is a status rep for Council 77, anyone want him to represent them knowing he may divulge information shared with him assuming it was confidential???
Now, let’s go back to the Confidentiality agreement that was on the agenda. I won’t mention any names but Chris, Paul Hopkins, Sean Creed, Paul Degrenier and Todd had suspected there was someone on the MEC that has close ties to the Chief Pilot’s Office. This suspicion stemmed from information the Company knew that had only been talked about in the MEC meetings. It was very apparent to Chris, Paul Hopkins, Sean Creed, Paul Degrenier and Todd Hirshon there was a company mole on the MEC. This was the reason for the confidentiality agreement…..to attempt to silence the mole.
After the recall of Chris and Paul, Todd Hirshon, who authored the agenda item, decided to withdraw it so the events could be transparent to the Spirit Pilots.
I believe our current MEC is compromised by the Council 77 and 109 representatives and cannot be trusted.
On the other side, Chris Amongero stepped up to replace Sean Creed as MEC Chairman and immediately engaged Spirit’s Management. He has given his energy, personal time and talents to defend our contract and keep Spirit’s Management from rolling over us.
Paul Hopkins was the Strategic Planning Coordinator before, during and after our strike of almost 5 years ago. His father was the author of “Flying the Line” (vol. 1 & 2). Because of our successful strike Paul was loaned to the ALPA National Strategic Planning Committee. Sean Creed led our pilots and the MEC in our most desperate times leading up to the strike. He was able to guide the LEC members and manage all of the other committees not directly connected to the strike preparedness. Sean and Andy Nelson oversaw the Negotiating Committee and let them develop the strategies that gave us our quality of life issue in our current CBA.
So there you have it, we now have an MEC Chairman who turned over pilots to spirit management that could “put themselves at serious risk for their jobs and livelihood”, and he apparently was the principle in orchestrating the covert recall of Chris and Paul. We have another status representative who records phone conversations with our members. Then we have one of the status representatives who apparently leaks MEC business to Spirit Management.
It would appear we have a real mess on our hands at the MEC level…..what are you going to do about it???
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Ha! I am back in. I'm just not on the political side of the house, if you catch my drift.
Not on the political side.....? What happened, did you quit....? ;-)
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
Yeah, kick out the people who successfully negotiated a hugely improved agreement and lead a hugely successful strike. Let me know how that works for you.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
sherpa said:
You knowing what they're up to, and them knowing what they're doing are two very different things. Which sounds more important?
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sherpa
Well-Known Member
Didn't realize I had to choose. Is it within the realm of possibility that they can do/be both?