German Wings A320 crashed

MikeD said:
Not weak at all. I've seen any number of people crap-canned in this program. it's not an easy program to live under/with, by any means. Maybe that's part of the problem.
Click to expand...
Well, yeah, having to pass tests is generally much harder to live with than cheating on them. The point is not that people get crap-canned, it's how and when they got crap canned, and especially why they got crap-canned and why those conditions were allowed to grow in the first place. In the Malmstrom case and many others like it, dysfunctional major and general (yeah, that's a pun) issues were allowed to exist and sometimes (often?) thrive. This will happen anywhere transparency is not allowed to exist and/or thrive. The issue boils down to the culture of service; the symmetry of alignment-to-mission and alignment-of-reward/punishment between management/leadership and labor/enlisted. When the high-priests become corrupted, the whole church becomes corrupted. The only way to prevent this is A. A robust culture of integrity and service, B. Transparency, or C. Both. I prefer both, but I'm all about checks and balances and systems that default to failsafe modes. Systems that prevent, rather than react to...
 
Crop Duster said:
Well, yeah, having to pass tests is generally much harder to live with than cheating on them. The point is not that people get crap-canned, it's how and when they got crap canned, and especially why they got crap-canned and why those conditions were allowed to grow in the first place. In this case and many others like it, dysfunctional major and general (yeah, that's a pun) issues were allowed to exist and sometimes (often?) thrive. This will happen anywhere transparency is not allowed to exist and/or thrive. The issue boils down to the culture of service; the symmetry of alignment-to-mission and alignment-of-reward/punishment between management/leadership and labor/enlisted. When the high-priests become corrupted, the whole church becomes corrupted. The only way to prevent this is A. A robust culture of integrity and service, B. Transparency, or C. Both. I prefer both, but I'm all about checks and balances and systems that default to failsafe modes.
Click to expand...

Sometimes those conditions don't grow, sometimes they're caught early. But when they do grow or progress, I agree, it needs to be discovered when/how it was found and why things went to the point they did.

Whether any of this would or could apply to a 121 operation, I have no idea.
 
La
Soku39 said:
+1 for me being another person agreeing that when we look back this will be one of the leading incidents preceeding the development of the pilotless airliner.
Click to expand...
Last night I watched a Top Gear episode and they talked about driverless cars, and that if say, here was an accident and the road was blocked because of it, and the only way to pass through was through the sidewalk, the car would take that detour. However, if there were people in the sidewalk, and one of the people of the other car was injured, the car would statistically calculate the best course of action - regardless of morality. So the best way to overcome that, would be with an Override button.

I seriously don't think they can do a purely pilotless aircraft. There will always be some moral dilemma that only human beings can evaluate.
 
MaRiO FDZ said:
La

Last night I watched a Top Gear episode and they talked about driverless cars, and that if say, here was an accident and the road was blocked because of it, and the only way to pass through was through the sidewalk, the car would take that detour. However, if there were people in the sidewalk, and one of the people of the other car was injured, the car would statistically calculate the best course of action - regardless of morality. So the best way to overcome that, would be with an Override button.

I seriously don't think they can do a purely pilotless aircraft. There will always be some moral dilemma that only human beings can evaluate.
Click to expand...
Maybe that's why they fired the host the other day. Don't need no stinkin' drivers no more... and cars don't go all froggy on producers... Lol.
 
scooter2525 said:
Sadly not the first time a pilot has done something with a plane. Few years ago a SKW guy took a plane in SGU. A GOOD mental health reform is needed.
Click to expand...
When I saw his pic on the company site at the time, I couldn't believe it. He was a real friendly guy who took interest in my career progression and flying and always stopped to chat for a minute when he passed by the gate I was working the few times I saw him at SFO. Then he went and killed his girlfriend and stole a jet to do God knows what. You really never know...

On that note, like you said, not the first time. There have been a couple instances of pilots stealing planes, also several instances of pilots diving into the ground with 1-2 other pilots in the cockpit with them. Here are two interesting examples I know of off hand of both:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_Air_Botswana_incident (he put on a full air show in an ATR-42 before taking out most of the airlines fleet)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Airlines_Flight_350 (despite killing 24 people, the pilot wasn't charged on grounds of "insanity")
 
Last edited:
Cptnchia said:
If so, then why wait for the other crew member to leave.?
Click to expand...

A fair question indeed. But also a logic question, when it comes to someone who may be thinking completely illogically.......or maybe totally logically, who knows.

scooter2525 said:
Sadly not the first time a pilot has done something with a plane. Few years ago a SKW guy took a plane in SGU. A GOOD mental health reform is needed.
Click to expand...

Craig Button stole his A-10 and crashed it into New York Mountain in Colorado.

Yet I see no worries about.....say......some F-16 pilot at Nellis AFB, say losing his ass at the Bellagio craps tables, then on Tuesday morning departing out of Nellis on a bombing mission, but instead of making the right turn off of RW 21, instead proceeding straight ahead and dropping a few thousand pounds of GPS or laser-guided ordnance through the front doors of the Bellagio's casino.....
 
ChasenSFO said:
When I saw his pic on the company site at the time, I couldn't believe it. He was a real friendly guy who took interest in my career progression and flying and always stopped to chat for a minute when he passed by the gate I was working the few times I saw him at SFO. Then he went and killed his girlfriend and stole a jet to do God knows what. You really never know...
Click to expand...
You really do have to watch out for each other, and I don't mean just in the context of stuff that results in the FAA getting interested/the airplane striking terrain.
 
MikeD said:
Possibly. But who knows if that would even make a difference, to someone hell bent on their mission. Just one person they'd have to take out before doing what they're going to do.
Click to expand...

Seems to me that it's a lot easier to be a coward and sit comfortably behind a locked door and wait for the plane to descend into a maintain than it is to hack a FA to death with a crash axe to stop her from opening the door. I'd bet just about anything that this never would have happened if he hadn't been allowed to be alone.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
Seems to me that it's a lot easier to be a coward and sit comfortably behind a locked door and wait for the plane to descend into a maintain than it is to hack a FA to death with a crash axe to stop her from opening the door. I'd bet just about anything that this never would have happened if he hadn't been allowed to be alone.
Click to expand...
Most crime is because of opportunity.
 
Oh lord, the local news is running the "…and the Arizona connection" coverage and interviewing random people around Goodyear where Lufthansa trains their ab initio students.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top