wheelsup
Well-Known Member
It's called venting, and it's human nature.
Envoy (Eagle) Passes TA
- Thread starter J Cole
- Start date
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
Understand that your situation was (and is) not the norm. Yes, it worked for you. And yes you worked hard to get where you are. But luck also played a large part in how it worked out. Some guys may get a bit salty with your constant Kit Darbying (did I just make a verb?) because not once do you mention the luck factor. For every one of you, there are 5 or 10 guys who have been in the same amount or even more effort that you did and yet while you are shining the widget on your hat brass, they are grabbing their flashlight to go do a walk around on an RJ in XYZville.
meyers9163
Well-Known Member
Come on now.... I've referred to it multiple times to multiple pilots, better resumes then mine, that I know I got lucky and won the "Lottery" for the lack of a better phrase....
Now I also worked my rear end off like you did to get the opportunity but some luck most definitely played into it....
wheelsup
Well-Known Member
You went to Airways. You really did win the lottery when they called your number to interview, as it was a random selection.
Not to mention, when most people who applied to Airways, well, applied, FOs at Delta/United made more than CAs at US, and a merger was but a figment of their imagination. The pool was pretty shallow.
It was basically all luck that everything happened like it did. However, I'd rather be lucky than good any day of the week.
A minority or woman is going to have the best "luck". I had a buddy at ASA who knew quite a few in both baskets that were hired, they had 2-3 years as FOs at ASA then on to Delta. I think it's pompous to presume everyone has the same "luck".
"All you have to do is go to a job fair, apply, and presto they call you in!!"
Ok.
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Trip7
Well-Known Member
Luck is when preparation meets opportunity
Gonzo
Well-Known Member
No some times luck is just luck.
When the meteorite hits you it's just being unlucky, when the meteorite hits the guy next to you it's call just being lucky.
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Gonzo
Well-Known Member
I am positive, hell if you ever see me at work I always have a smile on my face. Doing this beats a 9-5 everyday. Ask @Derg. Stating a fact does not equal complaining. I am staying positive and keep working more and more to get that call and for you to insinuate the reason why I haven't gotten a call because I'm not working hard enough is insulting and condescending.
chrisreedrules
Master Blaster
To be honest... I don't see how so many people think that "averaging pay" or having "one pay scale" would ever work at the regional level (or any level for that matter). Not all airlines are owned by the same parent companies, not all airlines are represented by the same union, and not all airlines have similar thinking pilot groups. It's delusional at best to keep talking about and wanting this. The whipsaw will continue, I have no doubt of this. It's just all about timing and a lucky roll of the dice. Get in at a growing airline at the beginning of a hiring wave and pray the music doesn't stop. That's the best any of us can hope for when it comes to starting out a career at the airlines. And I say starting out because it seems to me that the first choice is often the most important for an airline career. But what do I know? After 3 years of flying professionally I'm still just a babe in the woods with this industry.
Phil Schuyler
Well-Known Member
No one is talking about average pay or one pay scale. We're talking about using economic principles to your advantage. Regional flying gets shifted from carrier to carrier because long term pay scales create an economic advantage for the new carrier. It happened at AWAC 10 years ago, and it's happening at Envoy now. You get a bunch of employees (not just pilots) who are camped out at the top of the pay scale, driving average costs up. Shift flying to PSA, and that's 60 airplanes worth of employees (600 pilots, 30 FA's, 15 dispatchers, and who knows how many mechanics and service agents) that get added to the BOTTOM of the PSA scale, driving PSA's average, costs down. Meanwhile the people remaining at Envoy are the senior employees, which drives up Envoy's costs even more.
If you want to stop the whipsaw, then remove the economic advantage to the whipsaw. That's all I'm sayin'.
chrisreedrules
Master Blaster
And what economic principles do you suggest regional pilots use to their advantage? I understand what your saying, but I don't see how anything can/will be done about downward pressure on wages. Management is much smarter than the pilot groups. I'm pretty sure they have it figured out how they are going to keep their regional feed accepting low wages. They call the shots, and pilot groups react to them. There is no organization amongst regional pilots, only petty infighting. Once the pilot supply dries up to a point that regionals can't supply mainline with the feed they want, they aren't just going to magically pay more. They will figure something else out. If you go look in the AA thread over on the other forum you can read how quite a few pilots in their pilot group don't think the current projections coincide with the reality of what AAG will actually need to hire. With some schedule manipulation and contractual changes AAG likely won't need to hire near as many pilots as the projections are showing. Sure they are hiring now, but how long will this hiring wave continue? Another year or two? Maybe 5 or 6 (I can only hope!)? Maybe only one... The music could always stop tomorrow for all we know. Go to a regional with growth and movement and get the heck out of dodge. That regional just happens to coincide with a commutable base for me which I am grateful for.
Trip7
Well-Known Member
Where/when did I insinuate this? Quote please.
dasleben
That's just, like, your opinion, man
Dude c'mon, don't talk down to these guys like that. Kudos on making the jump from RJ FO to mainline pilot, but there are guys paddling just as hard for it (if not harder) and getting nowhere. While I'm leaning toward staying where I'm at for the time being, I can tell you that RJ time, lots of 135 PIC, and several years of overwater heavy jet time got me nowhere close to Delta.
Be grateful for where you're at, but be humble.
Trip7
Well-Known Member
Seriously? An popular inspirational quote is "talking down"?
http://lifehacker.com/luck-is-what-happens-when-preparation-meets-opportunit-821189862
dasleben
That's just, like, your opinion, man
Yes, I consider it talking down when put into context of how you've been posting in this thread. Most people who put in the preparation, and create the opportunity, are not getting calls. Be grateful. Be humble.
chrisreedrules
Master Blaster
That's what I'll have to remind myself when I walk around my old flight school in my shiny new regional get-up
Trip7
Well-Known Member
Ah context. So somehow stay positive and create opportunity for yourself was taken as you're lazy. Interesting,and not surprising.
dasleben
That's just, like, your opinion, man
I think you're just throwing rocks back at me, or you're not fully aware of how you're coming off in this thread. Go back 2-3 pages and understand why people are getting the impression that they are.
Trip7
Well-Known Member
No need to go in circles. The message is simple. You will be OK. Breathe. The hiring spree didn't end yesterday. It's just begun. Don't let regional politics take your mind over. Keep doing what you're do to improve yourself. Stay positive.
dasleben
That's just, like, your opinion, man
That's something I absolutely agree with. We're all just pointing out something you may want to look into with your postings. Namaste, etc.