tonyw
Well-Known Member
Wow. I thought it was the end for them when some hotels said they would stop putting them on people's doors every morning. Generally speaking, I'd step right over it on my way out of the hotel.
Sad Realization
- Thread starter Finhunter89
- Start date
Wow. I thought it was the end for them when some hotels said they would stop putting them on people's doors every morning. Generally speaking, I'd step right over it on my way out of the hotel.
Tommay85
Well-Known Member
The Metro has a "QRH" that the old program manager made. Close, but not quite complete.
The Brasilia does have a proper QRH.
I keep seeing things like SOPs, QRH, Crew, coordinating, team, ect... These are not specific to 121 and exist identically at Ameriflight. No, we don't check the jet box, but if dash 8 and Brasilia 121 guys get interviews, clearly not having jet time isnt the reason we're not getting calls. This is why there's a frustrated tone in these threads, and the Ameriflight thread in regards to this discussion. There are guys that are just as well connected getting the cold shoulder and it's kind of ridiculous in my opinion.
I don't think anyoneither at AMF thinks we deserve mainline jobs, but not even getting an interview because of some false stigma about 135 is annoying and does bring out a bitter tone occasionally, out of mevery at least, especially after a bit of Cruzan or Don Q rum.
I didn't come here for a short cut to a mainline carrier though. I came here because I felt at the time more doors of the aviation world would stay open over going straight 121. I didn't think a mainline door would open, but I didn't think it'd be locked either if I chose to go that direction... Oh well.
Inverted
mmmmmm wine
The Metro has a "QRH" that the old program manager made. Close, but not quite complete.
The Brasilia does have a proper QRH.
I keep seeing things like SOPs, QRH, Crew, coordinating, team, ect... These are not specific to 121 and exist identically at Ameriflight. No, we don't check the jet box, but if dash 8 and Brasilia 121 guys get interviews, clearly that isnt the reason we're not getting calls. This is why there's a frustrated tone in these threads, and the Ameriflight thread in regards to this discussion. There are guys that are just as well connected getting the cold shoulder and it's kind of ridiculous in my opinion.
I don't think anyone here thinks we deserve mainline jobs, but not even getting an interview because of some false stigma about 135 is annoying and does bring out a bitter tone occasionally, out of mevery at least, especially after a bit of Cruzan or Don Q rum.
I didn't come here for a short cut to a mainline carrier though. I came here because I felt at the time more doors of the aviation world would stay open over going straight 121. I didn't think a mainline door would open, but I didn't think it'd be locked either if I chose to go that direction... Oh well.
You don't get to "make" a QRH...
And the SOP operation is similar in nature, but crew coordination and CRM are not properly taught, nor properly executed in any AMF type with maybe the exception of the Bro. Sorry but it just isn't the same as a 135 jet or 121.
KLB
Well-Known Member
I believe that "QRH" that was made was approved by the FAA before I left.
Metro training is all done two crew btw. You don't even attempt flying it single pilot until a few days into IOE.
THAT
The ONE corporate outfit corporate outfit that I kind of have contact with does not give two poops what you've flown in the past. All they want is PIC time, some turbine time and total time for insurance. They want to get along with you during the 9 hours you might fly together. GV, G550, and Citation X operator.
Why part 121 main lines are all bent out of shape over having other 121 time or jet/glass/fms/crew is beyond me, but whatever. In my opinion, airplane, point A to B, in an expected time frame, ZERO difference! Again, whatever...
@z987k, I know you can back me up on this, and I know you like arguing on the internet.
Well, "kinda".
My #1 job is flying the aircraft and leading the crew.
However, a good chunk of it is customer service, problem solving, coordinating with other departments and making operational decisions in what has turned out to be, surprisingly, a lot of grey areas where you're not sure you've done the right thing, but you decided based on FARS/FOM/"gumption".
I guess the short cut, of sort, is a candidate who has prior experience so it's quick to get him up to speed and keep integration costs low.
Remember, the presumption is that everyone can fly a jet, which is why some airlines don't bother with simulator checks.
Yes. You remind us of that frequently.
@Autothrust Blue has wing-slung engines, just like the big boys.
Wait wait wait, nah, let me put this correctly. He's got wing slung engines, like the 737… "Ya know, the big ones". #swacommercial
SpiceWeasel
Tre Kronor
Nope; he was a high time Gulfstream V CA in the Northeast. Very capable guy. Training was 6 weeks from start of indoc to end of checkride. I took no breaks, and the most days off I had was 2 in a row, sometimes only 1. They don't allow really more than 1 repeat of a unit.
Many FOs are just bump on a log guys. For those of us who actively participated in the process, we dealt with all kinds of CAs that we had to keep violation free. So, just as the 121 process doesn't seem fair to you, your blanket "no glance" seems unfair to me. But it's aviation, a fraternity, and to get in with certain fraternities, certain boxes need to be checked. Your fraternity requires CA time. Ours desires 121 time. It is what it is.
I was told by a 121 operator that my nearly 7 years of 121 time wasn't enough; that I would need to go to Cape Air, thinking outside the box, to build some PIC...
Tommay85
Well-Known Member
All of that happens every day at Ameriflight. Probably at all freight operators.
I'm not purposefully being arguementative. I'm just pointing out that almost all of the things being said about 121, like it's specific to 121, are actually practiced at Ameriflight as well.
It isn't the wild west anymore, if it ever even was. At least, not to me.
SpiceWeasel
Tre Kronor
You've had to make customer service decisions for passengers?
Convincing @Derg might be possible with some nice gin, trying to convince HR that your freight company gives you customer service experience is a lesson in futility.
Don't make excuses why your experience is good enough, it's not, no matter what and where you fly.
Tommay85
Well-Known Member
Neither has a 121 freight guy...
Customer service isn't specific to aviation either
Dugie8
Well-Known Member
Tommay85
Well-Known Member
So I should bring entertaining consumables to the interview?
Inverted
mmmmmm wine
These AMF threads are getting old. At some point the AMF group needs to read the writing on the wall. There are multiple people in here telling you guys that your perception of how good you are, and how the flying you do is as relevant to the 121 world as every other facet of aviation are completely false.
Every time somebody tries to share a real world example of how it is, a current or former AMFer has to chime in defensively to say that you do all that stuff too. The bottom line, is if it were true, we would see guys go from AMF to the majors in droves and that is not the case.
Passengers add an entire new dynamic in which the average freight guy has no clue about. 121 SOPs are similar to how AMF operates (standardized flow followed by a checklist, standard callouts etc.). But that's where the cockpit operation similarities end. It's just a fact. It's evidenced by the hiring climate now. At the end of the day, for whatever the reason, it is the way it is and no amount of excuses will change the minds in charge of hiring.
Every time somebody tries to share a real world example of how it is, a current or former AMFer has to chime in defensively to say that you do all that stuff too. The bottom line, is if it were true, we would see guys go from AMF to the majors in droves and that is not the case.
Passengers add an entire new dynamic in which the average freight guy has no clue about. 121 SOPs are similar to how AMF operates (standardized flow followed by a checklist, standard callouts etc.). But that's where the cockpit operation similarities end. It's just a fact. It's evidenced by the hiring climate now. At the end of the day, for whatever the reason, it is the way it is and no amount of excuses will change the minds in charge of hiring.
Inverted
mmmmmm wine
It's the truth.
KLB
Well-Known Member
Nope. The reason the majors aren't hiring 135 freight guys is simply because HR is in charge of it. Around mid 2000 (during the lull in the industry) having prior 121 time became and another way to trim down the list.
It has nothing to do with the it being so different or difficult. If that was the case military guys wouldn't get hired.
I've left AMF with some good experience that's proven good for me in my current gig and that's nothing to be ashamed of. I'd still recommend AMF as a good experience builder after instructing. You have a lot of AMF hate for some reason. Haha
KLB
Well-Known Member
That's not what the Alaska recruiters told me.