United reaching out to ALPA FFD Carriers
- Thread starter amorris311
- Start date
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
It was a very frustrating drive, to say the least.
B767
Well-Known Member
That's what you get when a lot of guys want to leave well enough alone. They will realize when it's already too late. They don't see the advantages to spending 2% for ALL the additional things ALPA has to offer, besides an actual CBA
.Yet these same folks have no issues, on certain overnights, spending $20 for a chance to win $1,000. Pretty sure the %s are the same, and ALPA offers a lot more than $1,000 for the 2%.
EDIT: No idea if this is pure coincidence, or strategic timing, but isn't Heppner running for ALPA prez? Could potentially be looking for additional votes. Hopefully this doesn't go the way @kellwolf described after the election.
Last edited:
surreal1221
Well-Known Member
I do not know for sure, but I trust Jay is more focused on strengthening his pilot group right now.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
Captain Heppner is running for ALPA President, but he's always been more of a trade unionist and "true believer" than a certain other administration, so I think this is genuine and not a bid for votes. Frankly, I don't think he needs to do much more than show up in order to get FFD votes over his competition.
surreal1221
Well-Known Member
ATN_Pilot said:
It won't be a guaranteed winner, so I also suggest him using his ears to honestly listen to FFD pilot group's concerns vs. hearing them.
From what I have seen so far, he is a totally different brand of leadership.
Maximilian_Jenius
Super User
Who does he fly for?
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
United.
WestIndian425
Well-Known Member
Wait...seriously?! This is my first time hearing about this.
Autothrust Blue
”…trusting ze process…”
Yes, seriously.
GypsyPilot
Mohawk Town
So what happened?
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
I worked (briefly) with Jay at a negotiations training session at Herndon in 2007 or maybe 2008. At that point he was the co Comm Chair for UAL. We were on the same "team" for a simulated negotiations against the "company" (another team). He managed to take our group (me, an AWAC CA, two Alaska SPSC guys and a CMR Comm guy) and build us into a cohesive negotiating team, each with a (very dirty) nickname, that we all had to use when talking to each other, a strategy (that had nothing to do with what was on the paper) and a plan. We executed it perfectly (which included denying the other team lunch, messing with the temperature in the room and other shenanigans) and get pretty much everything we wanted to get out of the company.
That, coupled with how he led the UAL side during the merger with CAL, has given me great hope in ALPA's future if he manages to win the election.
amorris311
Well-Known Member
UAL FFD Open Houses – More Details
Compass Pilots:
The UAL MEC has released more details on the upcoming open houses for ALPA Fee for Departure (FFD) members, including dates for the first two events: August 13-14 at the UAL MEC office in Rosemont, IL. Two events will also be held in September in DEN, but those dates are still TBD.
Attached is the message from UAL MEC Chair Capt. Jay Heppner:
********************************
Fellow ALPA Pilot,
Last month, I introduced an exciting opportunity the pilots of United are offering fellow ALPA Members at Fee for Departure carriers. The United MEC is hosting a series of Open Houses designed to give you an opportunity to learn ways of advancing your career to a mainline carrier.
Please view this video for more information and details on these events.
As promised, I have some further details on the Open Houses:
-Visit alpa.org/ualmecfeefordeparture to register. Registration opens at noon Eastern Time on Monday, July 7 and closes at noon Eastern Time on Monday July 14.
-Registration is on a first come, first served basis, and space at the events is limited. Through the online registrations, pilots will be able to place, in order, preferences for open house dates and times. If the pilot’s first open house date and time preference is full, we will automatically place him or her in the second one. If the first, then second one is full, and their third preference has availability, they will be placed in that one and so forth.
-Our first event will be held on August 13 at the UAL ALPA Office in Rosemont, Ill. (near ORD) from 0900-1200. The second session that date will be held from 1300-1600.
Our second event will be held on August 14 at the UAL ALPA Office from 0900-1200. The second session that date will be held from 1300-1600.
Our third and fourth events will be held in September at the Denver Pilot Training facility (DENTK). We are still working on the exact dates for the September events. However, we still need to have these slots available in the registration link that opens on July 7 as August is a popular vacation month and we want to give pilots as much lead time as possible to bid around these dates in September. The dates are tentatively set for the second or third week of September and those pilots who bid for the September slots and are awarded the September slots will be told the week of July 21. The bottom line is we strongly urge everyone to sign up for all eight sessions, in order of your preferences to allow for maximum opportunity to be able to attend.
- Due to the high demand for this event, we anticipate every available slot to be filled. PILOTS WHO REGISTER AND ARE ENROLLED IN AN OPEN HOUSE will receive an email the week of July 21 confirming their registration date and time. You are not officially registered for this event until you receive this confirmation email during that week.
- Save the business suit for the interview! The dress code for this event is business casual.
- The first hour will be a presentation from Flight Operations, Human Resources, Line Check Airman, and Line Pilots. The final two hours of the event are going to be one-on-one meet and greets with the United Airlines Recruitment Team.
- Bring copies of your resume.
- There is no cost to attend these Open Houses outside of any the individual incurs while traveling to and from these events. Transportation options to our MEC Office or DENTK will be distributed once you receive your confirmation email.
- IT difficulties are part of our modern world. We can’t guarantee that there won’t be IT glitches in the registration process for these Open Houses. If you experience such difficulties when trying to register for an Open House, keep trying until your registration goes through.
- If these events fill up and we can’t accommodate you this time, you will be given priority in any future Open Houses we hold.
- These events are only open to Pilots at ALPA Represented FFDC Carriers.
Questions concerning the Open Houses should be directed to
ualmecfeefordeparture@alpa.org.
Thank you and I look forward to meeting you at one of the FFDC Open Houses.
Fraternally and in unity,
Captain Jay Heppner
Chairman, United Master Executive Council
Air Line Pilots Association, International
Compass Pilots:
The UAL MEC has released more details on the upcoming open houses for ALPA Fee for Departure (FFD) members, including dates for the first two events: August 13-14 at the UAL MEC office in Rosemont, IL. Two events will also be held in September in DEN, but those dates are still TBD.
Attached is the message from UAL MEC Chair Capt. Jay Heppner:
********************************
Fellow ALPA Pilot,
Last month, I introduced an exciting opportunity the pilots of United are offering fellow ALPA Members at Fee for Departure carriers. The United MEC is hosting a series of Open Houses designed to give you an opportunity to learn ways of advancing your career to a mainline carrier.
Please view this video for more information and details on these events.
As promised, I have some further details on the Open Houses:
-Visit alpa.org/ualmecfeefordeparture to register. Registration opens at noon Eastern Time on Monday, July 7 and closes at noon Eastern Time on Monday July 14.
-Registration is on a first come, first served basis, and space at the events is limited. Through the online registrations, pilots will be able to place, in order, preferences for open house dates and times. If the pilot’s first open house date and time preference is full, we will automatically place him or her in the second one. If the first, then second one is full, and their third preference has availability, they will be placed in that one and so forth.
-Our first event will be held on August 13 at the UAL ALPA Office in Rosemont, Ill. (near ORD) from 0900-1200. The second session that date will be held from 1300-1600.
Our second event will be held on August 14 at the UAL ALPA Office from 0900-1200. The second session that date will be held from 1300-1600.
Our third and fourth events will be held in September at the Denver Pilot Training facility (DENTK). We are still working on the exact dates for the September events. However, we still need to have these slots available in the registration link that opens on July 7 as August is a popular vacation month and we want to give pilots as much lead time as possible to bid around these dates in September. The dates are tentatively set for the second or third week of September and those pilots who bid for the September slots and are awarded the September slots will be told the week of July 21. The bottom line is we strongly urge everyone to sign up for all eight sessions, in order of your preferences to allow for maximum opportunity to be able to attend.
- Due to the high demand for this event, we anticipate every available slot to be filled. PILOTS WHO REGISTER AND ARE ENROLLED IN AN OPEN HOUSE will receive an email the week of July 21 confirming their registration date and time. You are not officially registered for this event until you receive this confirmation email during that week.
- Save the business suit for the interview! The dress code for this event is business casual.
- The first hour will be a presentation from Flight Operations, Human Resources, Line Check Airman, and Line Pilots. The final two hours of the event are going to be one-on-one meet and greets with the United Airlines Recruitment Team.
- Bring copies of your resume.
- There is no cost to attend these Open Houses outside of any the individual incurs while traveling to and from these events. Transportation options to our MEC Office or DENTK will be distributed once you receive your confirmation email.
- IT difficulties are part of our modern world. We can’t guarantee that there won’t be IT glitches in the registration process for these Open Houses. If you experience such difficulties when trying to register for an Open House, keep trying until your registration goes through.
- If these events fill up and we can’t accommodate you this time, you will be given priority in any future Open Houses we hold.
- These events are only open to Pilots at ALPA Represented FFDC Carriers.
Questions concerning the Open Houses should be directed to
ualmecfeefordeparture@alpa.org.
Thank you and I look forward to meeting you at one of the FFDC Open Houses.
Fraternally and in unity,
Captain Jay Heppner
Chairman, United Master Executive Council
Air Line Pilots Association, International
amorris311
Well-Known Member
More information released today regarding the UAL FFD Open House. I sincerely hope if you are interested you take the time to enroll.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
Right, because things would be just awesome at Envoy if ALPA wasn't around! Management wouldn't gut her work rules and pay her nothing, or anything, huh?
They could. But they can easily trash a CBA with BK threats, loss of fleet threats, gain of fleet promises, or actual BK itself. You continue to ignore the fact when it comes to regionals, the most successful in terms of pilot pay/QOL and securing business is Skywest - a non union pilot shop.
Maximilian_Jenius
Super User
And you continue to ignore the fact that he has you on ignore!
SpiceWeasel
Tre Kronor
Only because they have somewhat competent management.
As bad as PCL ALPA mangled the ISL, you can't possibly believe that the punishment endured by us under Uncle Phil would have been less as a non-union shop....
I would rather complain about crappy reps, whose seat in the union I control, than management that pisses away money like it's going out of style.
PCL management were the ones who decided that having a common FOM for 3 carriers wasn't that important. 9E/9L/XJ were under one holding company July 1 2010. The ISL came out a year later... Hence, pissing away money: for every one training event, 6 others occurred. No one ever expects to pay a 4th year guy to complete indoc...
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
I'm talking even pre-ISL and pre-mergers. Management offered a pay raise for 1st and 2nd year FOs but the union turned it down. They thought they had leverage. Management offered the "final and best offer" and that was turned down, I believe end of 2006 to early 2007. Pinnacle pilots continued in 1999 wages. Based on how the union handled things and what mangement offered, you and I would have made more with what management was trying to force us versus what the union got you 2007-2010. And all those things you just said in terms of post-Mesaba buyout were requirements once the contract/JCBA was agreed to. I was one of the guys raising a huge flag about allowing anyone and everyone to bid whatever they want across the certificates when we three were all separate, but I was quickly quieted down by those saying "it's contractual" and "it's seniority bidding power rights."
Contracts and pilot pay/benefits are always a factor of the airline's profitability. The more successful the airline is, the more likely the employee groups will obtain good pay, regardless of union status. Skywest is a perfect example. Weren't Delta's FAs non-union until the NWA merger? Yet compare their salaries in those days to other union legacy FAs. The biggest
Ah. That would because he is overly emotional about all things union and that ALPA can never be at fault. Even something as plain as concessions-for-jets at PSA, he maintains that it was just a negotiating position and the pilot group negotiated and then passed what they wanted best for their careers.
He will never admit a screwup in ALPA and holds disdain for anyone non-union.
SpiceWeasel
Tre Kronor
I'm talking even pre-ISL and pre-mergers. Management offered a pay raise for 1st and 2nd year FOs but the union turned it down. They thought they had leverage. Management offered the "final and best offer" and that was turned down, I believe end of 2006 to early 2007. Pinnacle pilots continued in 1999 wages. Based on how the union handled things and what mangement offered, you and I would have made more with what management was trying to force us versus what the union got you 2007-2010. And all those things you just said in terms of post-Mesaba buyout were requirements once the contract/JCBA was agreed to. I was one of the guys raising a huge flag about allowing anyone and everyone to bid whatever they want across the certificates when we three were all separate, but I was quickly quieted down by those saying "it's contractual" and "it's seniority bidding power rights."
Contracts and pilot pay/benefits are always a factor of the airline's profitability. The more successful the airline is, the more likely the employee groups will obtain good pay, regardless of union status. Skywest is a perfect example. Weren't Delta's FAs non-union until the NWA merger? Yet compare their salaries in those days to other union legacy FAs. The biggest
Ah. That would because he is overly emotional about all things union and that ALPA can never be at fault. Even something as plain as concessions-for-jets at PSA, he maintains that it was just a negotiating position and the pilot group negotiated and then passed what they wanted best for their careers.
The contract allowed cross bidding. That I had zero problem with. The company dropped the ball. But as per the usual with bankruptcy law, you and I pay for a corporation's mistakes.
I see many heads scratched when I explain that I agreed to a cut in wages and got a $6000 bonus in return.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
That was basically all XJ's doing in allowing cross bidding and forcing the company. With the Saabs being parked on an accelerated schedule, those CAs and FOs had to go somewhere. The company should never have agreed to immediate cross bidding without even an operational fence! Literally everyone cross bid and literally everyone had to go through initial. It was like the company just hired hundreds and hundreds of new CAs and FOs. Real management (Skywest) would have said no, we are not merging you right now. No cross bidding right now. We need to get our stuff together, and then we can talk about becoming one fluid airline with cross bidding. But that never happened.
Look at Trans States Airlines, Compass, and GoJets. All three are kept separate and all three in the past couple years have gained more airplanes for their own flying. I'm not saying Hulas is smart like Skywest management, but you have to admit, considering the Compass and Mesaba sales were concurrent, TS Holdings did much better than 9E Holdings by simply keeping them all separate.
?
The SSP was the hook for CAs, the one-time bonus was the hook for FOs.