New Eagle TA

BobDDuck said:
Ummm... Not really. It's pretty easy for an MEC Chair to dissolve a committee by MEC vote.
Click to expand...
Okay Ethan you are missing this - He did not know they were doing it at first. It was actually lead by the ORD CA rep, who was absent for the last meeting. When it finally came to light last week, the MEC Chair was faced with how to handle it. It would seem, rather than "out" the offenders, he protected it and worked for the greater good.

Why 6 people abstained is beyond me. The 3 reps I have spoken to today have told me there is A LOT more to it and much will come to light soon.
 
BobDDuck said:
Ummm... Not really. It's pretty easy for an MEC Chair to dissolve a committee by MEC vote.
Click to expand...
The rumor being floated around is the ORD CA rep and the school house rep negotiated independently of the rest of the union with the company.
 
LoadMasterC141 said:
This. It is fairly substantiated but the union has not yet officially confirmed it.
Click to expand...

Because it's not true except for the nut jobs over on Eagle Lounge.

One rep did approach the company on his own, but that had nothing to do with the result today. Enough information came to light for enough MEC reps that they felt another round of negotiations was imperative. We were on life support and have officially been given a stay of execution.

More information will come out in the following weeks, I'm sure.
 
Gonzo said:
The rumor being floated around is the ORD CA rep and the school house rep negotiated independently of the rest of the union with the company.
Click to expand...

That's not how it works, in a legal sense. The MEC (entire leadership) must authorize the NC (or anybody for that matter) to negotiate with the company. If they don't have a mandate to do so, they can't, or if they do, whatever they come up with isn't a legal agreement. Remember, once recognized by the NMB a union is the SOLE BARGAINING AGENT of the pilot group. Dig deeper and you'll see that there can be no bargaining without authorization from the MEC.

So, they may very well have met (illegally which should trigger the immediate recall of all the reps and committee members who played any part in it) but it's not a legal meeting per ALPA policy.
 
BobDDuck said:
That's not how it works, in a legal sense. The MEC (entire leadership) must authorize the NC (or anybody for that matter) to negotiate with the company. If they don't have a mandate to do so, they can't, or if they do, whatever they come up with isn't a legal agreement. Remember, once recognized by the NMB a union is the SOLE BARGAINING AGENT of the pilot group. Dig deeper and you'll see that there can be no bargaining without authorization from the MEC.

So, they may very well have met (illegally which should trigger the immediate recall of all the reps and committee members who played any part in it) but it's not a legal meeting per ALPA policy.
Click to expand...
Thank you very much. @LoadMasterC141
 
BobDDuck said:
That's not how it works, in a legal sense. The MEC (entire leadership) must authorize the NC (or anybody for that matter) to negotiate with the company. If they don't have a mandate to do so, they can't, or if they do, whatever they come up with isn't a legal agreement. Remember, once recognized by the NMB a union is the SOLE BARGAINING AGENT of the pilot group. Dig deeper and you'll see that there can be no bargaining without authorization from the MEC.

So, they may very well have met (illegally which should trigger the immediate recall of all the reps and committee members who played any part in it) but it's not a legal meeting per ALPA policy.
Click to expand...
It is not that cut and dry. The ORD CA rep, a self proclaimed "management pilot" met with his buddy, our DO and the president. Then others got involved. The problem is no one will admit it outright and there is not enough proof to do anything about it. They all know it happened. That is why the vice chair got the boot today. The ORD CA rep already has a recall on his agenda, if he would ever hold a meeting at his domicile he would be cooked.

The chair, and the rest of the union leadership were extremely angry because they were using a different tactic: " see who blinks first". Eagle lost 114 pilots in the last 2 months and gained a small handful. The union knew that the company could never sustain those losses and it would be over in a year. So did the company. Instead though, some rogue asshats took it on themselves to go tell, nay convince, the company that it was union conspiracy and that it would pass if it went to the pilots.

So how did the TA arrive on the MECs laps? The company brought it, unsolicited. They also said they believed it would pass the pilots and therefore were not willing to negotiate any further until it was sent to the pilots, slightly sweetened because they did not even believe themselves.
 
Last edited:
There is certainly a lot of mud slinging going on, and it's only been a matter of a few hours. I will reserve my right to judge until I learn more on how it went down, including on why six members decided to abstained. Let them explain their actions before we crucify them.
 
Skyvector said:
The problem is that there are a group of people here at Eagle who are so anti-management they would vote NO to anything. The company could offer up raises and they would still want to burn this place to the ground.

This TA may not be perfect, but it offers us career progression and stability on a level never before seen at ANY Regional airline. Period.
Click to expand...

Hi. Welcome to Jetcareers. Care to introduce yourself?
 
bLizZuE said:
If you're mad that it passed the MEC, you should call your rep that you all high-fived for voting no last time, and ask why they abstained and failed to properly represent your wishes.
Click to expand...
I have already contacted my reps. Please don't assume I am angry about it. You and I most certainly agree that abstinence is a choice. Choosing not to participate in a vote for reasons that have not been presented is not something I can condemn. I think there is quite a bit that goes on behind the scenes that we will never know, which is unfortunate, but transparency is never the name of the game. I'm just calling it like I personally see it, a sad state of affairs.... But nobody ever claimed this was a democracy.
 
Last edited:
Skyvector said:
Because it's not true except for the nut jobs over on Eagle Lounge.

One rep did approach the company on his own, but that had nothing to do with the result today. Enough information came to light for enough MEC reps that they felt another round of negotiations was imperative. We were on life support and have officially been given a stay of execution.

More information will come out in the following weeks, I'm sure.
Click to expand...
Then take us off the machine. I can go make $35k with my eyes closed. I'll be damned if I am going to give another red cent to a company bursting at the seams with money, when my services are actually in high demand for once. Shut the effin place down, along with Xjet, RAH, and others to follow. That will attract those new pilots!
 
LoadMasterC141 said:
Taken from a Facebook page:
Since voting down the company's request for concessions, certain members of our union ignored all union LAWS and re-engaged the company. Today, in Washington DC, the company and these scumbags made it possible, through dirty politics, to get the concessionary agreement back on the table for pilot vote, with some slight improvements. That's right, in the face of a pilot shortage and the largest profits AA has ever seen, these idiots want pilots to fly bigger airplanes for less money. They want us to accept an agreement with a company we should supposedly trust - The same company that said "sign this or we will never come back" and then CAME BACK WEEKS LATER. Put it to a vote then! Let the company see us stand strong with the 6000+ pilots of Expressjet and Republic and say NO MORE CONCESSIONS!!!!
Click to expand...

Here's the question.

Which "law" did the negotiators make by… negotiating?

If it's an untenable AIP, the Facebook poster will have an opportunity to cast his vote.

I don't think there's a such thing as a "filibuster" in labor law.
 
Derg said:
Here's the question.

Which "law" did the negotiators make by… negotiating?

If it's an untenable AIP, the Facebook poster will have an opportunity to cast his vote.

I don't think there's a such thing as a "filibuster" in labor law.
Click to expand...
Well that's the problem: They were not negotiators, on the negotiating committee. The MEC passed a resolution that authorized members of the negotiating committee to negotiate on their behalf and AT THE DIRECTION of the MEC. Again, none of these individuals were a part of that committee.
 
LoadMasterC141 said:
Then take us off the machine. I can go make $35k with my eyes closed. I'll be damned if I am going to give another red cent to a company bursting at the seams with money, when my services are actually in high demand for once. Shut the effin place down, along with Xjet, RAH, and others to follow. That will attract those new pilots!
Click to expand...

Unfortunately your services are not as high in demand as you think.

Remember that 50 seaters are an endangered species. Other airlines will park all their 50 seat jets in the next few years regardless of contracts.

That will allow any airline to take on new 70 seat aircraft. Airlines will eliminate unprofitable routes and aircraft.

Also, don't underestimate the bubble we are currently in. There are plenty of pilots currently sitting on 500 to 800 hours of flight time coming up the pipe.

Don't let all this media attention fool you. It's the airlines and the RAA putting these stories out in hopes of reversing the 1500 hour rule.
 
Skyvector said:
Unfortunately your services are not as high in demand as you think.

Remember that 50 seaters are an endangered species. Other airlines will park all their 50 seat jets in the next few years regardless of contracts.

That will allow any airline to take on new 70 seat aircraft. Airlines will eliminate unprofitable routes and aircraft.

Also, don't underestimate the bubble we are currently in. There are plenty of pilots currently sitting on 500 to 800 hours of flight time coming up the pipe.

Don't let all this media attention fool you. It's the airlines and the RAA putting these stories out in hopes of reversing the 1500 hour rule.
Click to expand...
What pipeline would that be? How many is plenty? Do you have any substantive proof?

I can tell you I have definitive proof to the contrary. Very much to the contrary.

You just pegged your whole argument on parking of "ALL 50 seaters in the next few years", and "Plenty of pilots in the pipeline? Ouch.

Next!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top