Common myth I been noticing among pilots

Fly_Unity

Fly_Unity

Well-Known Member
Wind calm, and your doing a perfect forward slip to lose some altitude. you get to slow and stall (There is no yawing movement on the nose, however you got full rudder deflection)

Will you spin? Why does everyone think that you will go in an instant spin if you stall doing a forward slip?

Its amazing how many pilots are amazed when I demonstrate a crossed control stall and we dont spin, but simply just break just like a normal coordinated stall.

Why are CFI's teaching students to look at the ball instead of looking for a yawing motion with wings level?

A spin results from a stall that has a yawing motion, not an "uncoordinated stall"

Am I right here?
 
It depends on what kind of cross controlling you're doing.

Stall + roll and yaw coupling (e.g., working together, as in a skid) = airplane will spin.

Stall + roll and yaw acting in opposition (e.g., a properly executed slip, rudder up and wing down) = it depends, but you're not going to spin. According to the Airplane Flying Handbook (8-11) you might even see an improvement in stall characteristics.
 
According to some on here, you're stalled in any forward slip with power idle because you're not maintaining altitude.
 
Roger said:
According to some on here, you're stalled in any forward slip with power idle because you're not maintaining altitude.
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lol, nice comeback

but...I think you misunderstand, For checkride purposes - 1; power idle, 2; FULL up elevator, 3; can not maintain altitude, THEN you are in a "stall"
 
Fly_Unity said:
Why are CFI's teaching students to look at the ball instead of looking for a yawing motion with wings level?
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It seems that most CFIs are not properly trained or tested on spin awareness. If the proper testing were happening, the training would be occurring.
A spin results from a stall that has a yawing motion, not an "uncoordinated stall"

Am I right here?
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Right. A yawing moment must be introduced to initiate the spinning moment.

I keep tellin' em: Keep the nose straight. With the rudder. No matter what else is happenin', keep the nose straight. With the rudder.
 
A150K said:
I'd like to personally yank anyone's cert. who actually thought that....
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It's a pretty funny part of a thread. Look. Even in this thread, FlyUnity said that if you are in a power-off dive and you pull the yoke all the way back, until you actually recover to level flight, you're in a stall (since you're still descending). :D
 
Cheyenne said:
I did a full flap, full deflection slip, with the power at 15" today... and I lived (ghasp)
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Just curious, with the Sled (which I assume youre flying based in your location and a few other things you've posted) why would you not just go power idle if you need to get down rather than slipping with power still in? Seems kinda like being on the gas and the brake at the same time, counterproductive. Is your company really anal about not letting the prop drive the engine?
 
I could see a situation when cross controlled where the rudder's effectiveness increases relative to the the aileron input when approaching a stall that could cause a yaw/spin. Depends on the airplane, obviously. I would say in most training aircraft, this isn't the case.
 
Roger said:
Just curious, with the Sled (which I assume youre flying based in your location and a few other things you've posted) why would you not just go power idle if you need to get down rather than slipping with power still in? Seems kinda like being on the gas and the brake at the same time, counterproductive. Is your company really anal about not letting the prop drive the engine?
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Not sure why Cheyenne did it, but Im going to assume it was to keep the CHT's at normal temps. I found in the dead of winter when its cold, sometimes its needed to keep the power in, to keep the CHT's within normal temps in some of the high performance singles I fly when center wont let me down.
 
Roger said:
Just curious, with the Sled (which I assume youre flying based in your location and a few other things you've posted) why would you not just go power idle if you need to get down rather than slipping with power still in? Seems kinda like being on the gas and the brake at the same time, counterproductive. Is your company really anal about not letting the prop drive the engine?
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Well, Fly Unity pretty much nailed it on the head. These big Conties crack cylinders real easy. And based on lower 48 standards theres no such thing as non-winter ops so you keep the power in the green, stage cool and all that jazz. You don't have to... but you'll end up flying the pigs of the fleet every shift. I do my best to keep my prop clean and my engines making power and MX rewards me with good planes and some okay Rum:rawk: Not to mention that I don't dig the thought of MXing down in Chefornak or some other hell hole.
 
Cheyenne said:
Well, Fly Unity pretty much nailed it on the head. These big Conties crack cylinders real easy. And based on lower 48 standards theres no such thing as non-winter ops so you keep the power in the green, stage cool and all that jazz. You don't have to... but you'll end up flying the pigs of the fleet every shift. I do my best to keep my prop clean and my engines making power and MX rewards me with good planes and some okay Rum:rawk: Not to mention that I don't dig the thought of MXing down in Chefornak or some other hell hole.
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Shock cooling is less of a joke when it is -30 out. Chefornak has a very nice bed and breakfast, it even has running water! BedandBreakfastCYF.jpg
 
Cheyenne said:
Well, Fly Unity pretty much nailed it on the head. These big Conties crack cylinders real easy. And based on lower 48 standards theres no such thing as non-winter ops so you keep the power in the green, stage cool and all that jazz. You don't have to... but you'll end up flying the pigs of the fleet every shift. I do my best to keep my prop clean and my engines making power and MX rewards me with good planes and some okay Rum:rawk: Not to mention that I don't dig the thought of MXing down in Chefornak or some other hell hole.
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Eh I guess I just figured by the time you're at 15" you're about as cool as you're gonna get and going down to idle wouldn't make much difference. I guess that is not the case though. The Lycs are a much more durable engine... In, oh, probably 5000 engine-hours that I've worked at my current operator we've had exactly 2 cylinder problems on Lycs-one cracked head and one that ate an exhaust valve. Oddly enough, both were on the same cylinder, same airplane (different engines though). Contrast that with our 2 IO520s... In 1300 engine hours, 7 cylinder replacements. I should add that based on my limited ride along experiences, our guys aren't exactly bagging the Lycs. Certainly not yanking power to idle several miles from the airport and doing a Vno glide in, but also no 1" per minute stuff.
 
I tried 6 times to get a 172 to spin with full rudder deflection. But depends on the aircaft, if the aircraft is inheritinly unstable, and the controls are not cordianted, and the wings stall the possibility of getting into a spin is there, and dont want to try it
 
Capt Obvious said:
I tried 6 times to get a 172 to spin with full rudder deflection. But depends on the aircaft, if the aircraft is inheritinly unstable, and the controls are not cordianted, and the wings stall the possibility of getting into a spin is there, and dont want to try it
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you're+doing+it+wrong.jpg
 
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