surreal1221
Well-Known Member
Joliet had a wonderful suggestion. Hopefully he will post it here so that I don't have to steal it from another aviation venue. Come on loverboy.
American to furlough again...
- Thread starter CRJDriver
- Start date
subpilot
Squawking 7600
They were from the bottom of the seniority list. Base and type does not play a factor in this. If they did mostly come from one base or type then that would just be coincidence.
Gonzo
Well-Known Member
He is right with this one. AA has over 300 pilots that are 60+.
Gonzo
Well-Known Member
Here is the official HI6 (Company Email) sent out to AA pilots:
_______________________________________
21JAN10/2355
******************AMERICAN AIRLINES AVIATORS*******************
************************PILOT FURLOUGHS************************
I HAVE THE UNPLEASANT RESPONSIBILITY OF ANNOUNCING THE FURLOUGH
OF UP TO 175 PILOTS IN THE FIRST HALF OF 2010, WITH THE FIRST
FURLOUGH OF 80 EFFECTIVE MARCH 1. THIS FURLOUGH WILL GO THROUGH
XXXXXX X. XXXXX, SEN #9545. YOUR CHIEFS ARE WORKING TO GET IN
TOUCH WITH THESE PILOTS AND PERSONALLY NOTIFY THEM. THE COMPANY
WILL CONTINUE WORKING WITH THE APA TO DEVELOP POSSIBLE FURLOUGH
MITIGATION SOLUTIONS AND IS PLEASED THAT OUR CONVERSATIONS HAVE
ALREADY PRODUCED POSITIVE RESULTS.
.
I BEAR THIS NEWS WITH GREAT SADNESS. WE HAVE ALL WORKED SO HARD
TO ENSURE THE SUCCESS OF OUR AIRLINE - NONE HARDER THAN THE
PILOTS IMPACTED BY THIS ANNOUNCEMENT. MY THOUGHTS AND PRAYERS
ARE WITH THESE PILOTS, AS WELL AS THOSE ALREADY ON FURLOUGH.
THESE INDIVIDUALS ARE OUR FRIENDS AND COLLEAGUES. THEY ARE A
PART OF WHAT MAKES THIS PILOT CORPS THE FINEST IN THE INDUSTRY,
AND I LOOK TO THE DAY WHEN WE WILL BE ANNOUNCING THEIR RECALL.
.
REGARDS, MARK HETTERMANN
ENTER HI6P TO PRINT THIS MESSAGE
FYI: Hettermann is an ass.
_______________________________________
21JAN10/2355
******************AMERICAN AIRLINES AVIATORS*******************
************************PILOT FURLOUGHS************************
I HAVE THE UNPLEASANT RESPONSIBILITY OF ANNOUNCING THE FURLOUGH
OF UP TO 175 PILOTS IN THE FIRST HALF OF 2010, WITH THE FIRST
FURLOUGH OF 80 EFFECTIVE MARCH 1. THIS FURLOUGH WILL GO THROUGH
XXXXXX X. XXXXX, SEN #9545. YOUR CHIEFS ARE WORKING TO GET IN
TOUCH WITH THESE PILOTS AND PERSONALLY NOTIFY THEM. THE COMPANY
WILL CONTINUE WORKING WITH THE APA TO DEVELOP POSSIBLE FURLOUGH
MITIGATION SOLUTIONS AND IS PLEASED THAT OUR CONVERSATIONS HAVE
ALREADY PRODUCED POSITIVE RESULTS.
.
I BEAR THIS NEWS WITH GREAT SADNESS. WE HAVE ALL WORKED SO HARD
TO ENSURE THE SUCCESS OF OUR AIRLINE - NONE HARDER THAN THE
PILOTS IMPACTED BY THIS ANNOUNCEMENT. MY THOUGHTS AND PRAYERS
ARE WITH THESE PILOTS, AS WELL AS THOSE ALREADY ON FURLOUGH.
THESE INDIVIDUALS ARE OUR FRIENDS AND COLLEAGUES. THEY ARE A
PART OF WHAT MAKES THIS PILOT CORPS THE FINEST IN THE INDUSTRY,
AND I LOOK TO THE DAY WHEN WE WILL BE ANNOUNCING THEIR RECALL.
.
REGARDS, MARK HETTERMANN
ENTER HI6P TO PRINT THIS MESSAGE
FYI: Hettermann is an ass.
wheelsup
Well-Known Member
So you're talking about yourself then? OK thanks, just checking.
We all took the job making peanuts, bro. Just because you make more now as a CA doesn't mean you can look down on others for taking the job as an FO. I mean WTF?
IMO the pay at the regionals isn't so bad, it's the job security that blows. If the job was much more stable and secure it wouldn't be so bad.
joliet
New Member
Furlough the guys over age 60. They knew the rules before they were hired, during the 30-40 years they spent at American. It was their career expectation to retire at 60, why should they get 5 more years at a junior pilot's expense?
The individual pilot groups should have an LOA furloughing all pilots over 60 before the most junior pilot.
300+ Geezers @ AMR are in fact stealing from the most junior pilots per what was expected throughout their entire careers. Isn't that what all seniority lists are about these days? It keeps coming down to career expectations.
This is the only way the Age 65 rule could be even remotely considered fair to airline pilots as a whole.
:bandit:
The individual pilot groups should have an LOA furloughing all pilots over 60 before the most junior pilot.
300+ Geezers @ AMR are in fact stealing from the most junior pilots per what was expected throughout their entire careers. Isn't that what all seniority lists are about these days? It keeps coming down to career expectations.
This is the only way the Age 65 rule could be even remotely considered fair to airline pilots as a whole.
:bandit:
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
Wheels and selective quoting FTW, I guess. Pretty sure he's still there because of the number of days off.
wheelsup
Well-Known Member
Who cares why he is there, he was hired as an F/O making hardly any money (and at a company that didn't pay in training...) just as we all were.
wildfreightess
Well-Known Member
I wondered what they were going to do with their people once they pulled out of STL and RDU. Now I know.
surreal1221
Well-Known Member
Plus fifty
Who gives a rats ass about expectation? Seniority is everything; and that's "the rules" you talk about, like it or not. The junior guys knew "the rules" when they came onboard about how seniority works, and when it doesn't work in their favor, they now want someone else to blame. Age 65 is passed and the senior guys are allowed to take part in it. Why? Because:
1. There are no guarantees.
2. Life isn't fair.
3. Timing is everything
4. Seniority has its privileges
That's just how it is, like it or not. Of course, those with the seniority not privy to these perks will obviously feel like they're being "stolen from".
Stolen from.........you've got to be kidding me. You think there should be an LOA over who gets furloughed, propose it for a vote.
joliet
New Member
Hehehehehe.
There is no rule to seniority that says you cannot have an LOA that furloughs over 60 lottery winners. It would be great to have it brought up for a vote. You would probably see a tremendous turn out among junior pilots who had been tuned into the campaign for such an agreement. All the gummers are too worried with which denture cream works best, and what to spend the cash from next week's open time trip. Presents for the grand kids, or a Thai massage.
I would imagine there would be a sunset to the agreement after a few years, at the most within 5 years of December 2012.
joliet
New Member
Nice try.
Nobody is going to the CEO telling the guy that they will fly for free, or making up a story about how dangerous the other pilot is. That's what you find in business aviation, at least one new story posted online every week, somewhere. Imagine how many go unannounced?
Stabby stab stab in the back. You are right, all the Geezers riding the Geezermeter stabbed every junior pilot in the face with Uncle Sam's hand.
Gonzo
Well-Known Member
You mean like fact that most of the over 60 guys are on the A-Scale. The ones that voted in the screw your buddy scale. The ones with a guaranteed A- fund.
What was rightfully yours that was taken away, or that you already had?
Besides the sense of entitlement?
CFIscare
Well-Known Member
Not everybody who is over 60 works for AA...
I would much rather see the guys who are nearing retirement and who have lost their retirement gain an extra five years than a much younger pilot who has many more years left in their career. They have lost a lot more than us.
Gonzo
Well-Known Member
You don't get it. The AA pilots that are over 60 are the ones I am talking about. They have a guaranteed A- fund, and a better pay scale.
And how long have they been there? Are they 2nd yr FOs? They're senior. They have seniority. They were once in your shoes and likely faced similar, though maybe not exact, burdens. It's sucks for junior guys, I fully understand. But like the cliche, instead of hating the player, hate the game. Everyone knew the job was dangerous when they took it: They when they joined, and you when you joined.
Longevity does have its perks.