Better start your flight training soon...

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Seggy said:
I really don't see what the big deal is here to get in line with the rest of the world.
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Seggy, I believe you're a member on another professional pilot forum. Ask Silver Wings about "the rest of the world" and user fees.

How about Colgan having to buy slots for Newark. Same principal, right? How much of a fight would be put up against that proposal. Oh wait, it already happened.

We do NOT want to go down that road.

Good reading: http://www.aweu.org/ext_files/userfees.pdf
 
All youse rich pilots should be paying for me to go visit my bros anyhow. All those guys up front over paid anyway. :sarcasm: (In case you couldn't tell). Next we should be charging those military guys for using the system.
 
Well what do you guys expect under Obama? The air to be free? It's very evident that they want to turn the U.S into socialist Europe. The people brought this upon themselves. Enjoy. Let's see how much more he can do in 3 years to choke capitalism.
 
Well what do you guys expect under Obama? The air to be free? It's very evident that they want to turn the U.S into socialist Europe. The people brought this upon themselves, all 55 percent of them. Enjoy. Let's see how much more he can do in 3 years to choke capitalism.
 
Bush wanted user fees too, only under a slightly different system. He wanted to privatize ATC.

Whether its privatized or kept under the governments control with user fees, its going to be a bad deal either way for GA.
 
Heard in May 2011:

"Chicago Approach, November 4521Whiskey 8000' with Zulu"

"21Whiskey, Chicago Approach, radar contact, go ahead"

"Chicago Approach Visa Card 6585483885834 Expires 2/13"

"21 Whiskey, you're cleared the ILS 13C to midway"
 
Change you can beleive in!!

It will be fun to watch the libs who six months ago would be against this jump on the user fee band wagon now that the "Chosen One" has decided to double tax G.A.

What about all the taxes G.A. pilots pay in fuel taxes who never even fly IFR? Will they now get a credit? CHANGE!!!!!
 
Seggy said:
I really don't see what the big deal is here to get in line with the rest of the world.
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Wow. So if everyone else does it it must be ok? Are you remotely familiar with GA in other countries? Ever wonder why they all come here to train?
Good grief. I mean, sure tote the Union line all you want in the 121 world but when it comes to GA all it takes is a little common sense-which so many seem to lack.
 
Toonces said:
Change you can beleive in!!

It will be fun to watch the libs who six months ago would be against this jump on the user fee band wagon now that the "Chosen One" has decided to double tax G.A.

What about all the taxes G.A. pilots pay in fuel taxes who never even fly IFR? Will they now get a credit? CHANGE!!!!!
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You sir, are a racist!
 
SIUav8er said:
Seriously? Hows GA in Europe? or Sweden? Is it a thriving industry like the US? not really... I dont want to get in line with the rest of the world.
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GA is dying in the United States anyway unfortunetly.

TFaudree_ERAU said:
Seggy, I believe you're a member on another professional pilot forum. Ask Silver Wings about "the rest of the world" and user fees.

How about Colgan having to buy slots for Newark. Same principal, right? How much of a fight would be put up against that proposal. Oh wait, it already happened.

We do NOT want to go down that road.
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The slot fight and user fees are completely different.

BajtheJino said:
Wow. So if everyone else does it it must be ok? Are you remotely familiar with GA in other countries? Ever wonder why they all come here to train?
Good grief. I mean, sure tote the Union line all you want in the 121 world but when it comes to GA all it takes is a little common sense-which so many seem to lack.
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Want our airspace modernized? Someone is going to need to pay for it. Much rather have it paid for by those who use it than taken out of my paycheck.
 
Seggy said:
GA is dying in the United States anyway unfortunetly..
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Yes. Thanks in no small part to ridiculous litigation, skyrocketing fuel, and the inability of manufacturers to produce affordable aircraft and parts (see litigation again). It's sad.


Seggy said:
Want our airspace modernized? Someone is going to need to pay for it. Much rather have it paid for by those who use it than taken out of my paycheck.
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Really, I don't give a flying flip. I haven't had a problem getting from point A to point B with my students.
 
Seggy said:
GA is dying in the United States anyway unfortunetly.
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why accelerate the process?


Seggy said:
The slot fight and user fees are completely different.
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How so? its a fee to access the system. same principle

Seggy said:
Want our airspace modernized? Someone is going to need to pay for it. Much rather have it paid for by those who use it than taken out of my paycheck.
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I think the aviation trust fund would work just fine if the congress would stop re-allocating the funds (kinda like the social security mess). i dont trust our federal government with money... all they do is spend more than they have and then expect us to pay it back with higher taxes.
 
Seggy said:
GA is dying in the United States anyway unfortunetly.
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It is? Maybe you should spend some time at your local airport.


Seggy said:
Want our airspace modernized? Someone is going to need to pay for it. Much rather have it paid for by those who use it than taken out of my paycheck.
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I'm not sure what this means. Every night the plane I fly buys 600 gallons of fuel or so, we're paying our fair share. Not to mention you're paying for this "modernization" out of your paycheck regardless. Do you really believe that just because people start paying for ATC services you're not going to continue to fund the system through taxes. Have you not paid attention to how our government works? More money doesn't mean better, it means that money is routed somewhere else i.e. programs that don't work.
Besides, you can't modernize airspace. Only the tools you use to manage that airspace. Dig this, GA is not the problem. It's the airlines that went from a jet that could seat a couple of hundred to using bugsmashers that seat 50 or less. You do the math and tell me whose really to blame.

Seggy said:
Ever fly the Northeast corridor?
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How did I know this was going to be your sole arguement. The problem of the Northeast is not a problem faced in 98% of the country. So because of ONE problem area the rest of the country should suffer. Great. Thanks alot.
 
TFaudree_ERAU said:
Good reading: http://www.aweu.org/ext_files/userfees.pdf
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That's an eye opener. I knew it was expensive, but I had no idea it was that bad. Seems to me the way the whole approach payment system is set up, it pushes pilots to do things unsafe, in order to keep the costs down. Am I out of line thinking that?

Seggy said:
GA is dying in the United States anyway unfortunetly.

The slot fight and user fees are completely different.

Want our airspace modernized? Someone is going to need to pay for it. Much rather have it paid for by those who use it than taken out of my paycheck.
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Its dying here in the US because of people who don't give a rip about it. Everyone wants to blame GA for the delays that airlines endure. I fail to see how its GA's fault. When was the last time you saw 15-20 172's decide to show up at JFK/ORD/LAX? While, we know we can do it, we don't, because it wouldn't feel right.

I fail to see you think how slot systems and user fee are different? Either way, its a pay to play system.

Why modernize the airspace? Sure, it would help a bit, but NextGen isn't the answer. You want to get rid of the delays, put more concrete on the ground. That will do a vastly better job that this whole NextGen waste of money.
 
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