Why are professional pilots so cheap (for no reason)

A scene I recall from two years ago will stick in my head for the rest of my time in aviation.

It was in the cafeteria of a legacy airline's training center. Groundschools were on lunch break, from DC-9 to 747. Pilots and flight attendants were in line buying lunch when one grey haired man dropped his change on the floor when it was his turn to pay.

First he picked up the change that had fallen right where his feet were.

Then he motioned for those in line behind him to go around. He put his tray down, got on all fours, and reached under the refrigerated drink and salad machines, sweeping his arm through what was probably a mess of cobwebs and coming up with a few nickels and dimes and putting them back on his tray. A few in line smirked and briskly walked around him.

A half hour later while walking down a hall of classrooms I saw him walk into the B-747-400 room with a younger guy. He was 744CA, at the time making $250+ per hour.

At first I thought it was ridiculous for someone making so much money to do that. The more time passes by, the more it makes sense. A 15% paycut ensued at that company and later an even larger one came along with contract concessions. And who knows how many times he might have already been furloughed in his younger days.

I save all my change.
 
It's funny because one night my wife and I were walking our dog thru our apartment complex. We passed (all late model) two Mercedes, two BMWs, an Infinity G35 coupe and sedan, two Nissan 350 Zs, a Land Rover and a Range Rover (that one was brand spankin' new), two Jaguars, a Lincoln Navigator, and a Hummer H3. I felt pretty damn poor that night :D.

With Nick's story - if that was a high level manager somewhere making $250k+ do you think they'd be eating in a cafeteria for one and two if they dropped a $100 bill on the ground you wouldn't see them in a million years on their knees trying to get underneath appliances to pick it up.

It seems much more prominent with people connected to aviation to be extremely frugal. I'm just wondering why that is. I think it's how we were brought into the industry. For those that didn't work their way into a high paying corporate job via another means - most of us CFI'd for peanuts, worked our way thru first year pay at a freight company, commuter, and/or regional etc. meanwhile facing possible job losses along the way. It's almost like we are brainwashed to be frugal from day 1 :).
 
I think its left over from the days of CFIing. When I first started instructing, I wasn't making hardly anything. There's always that horrible thought in the back of your head "I dunno if I'm gonna get all my bills paid this month". I'm doing much much better now, but sometimes that feeling still hits ya. Builds character I guess.
 
I remember how much my father brought home every 2 weeks as a steel worker. We lived a very simple but secure life. I never lacked for anything but we never drove new cars or had fancy things. I find myself today making as the same amount in 2 weeks as my father made in a year. I just can't bring myself to throw money away knowing how hard my father worked to support our family on so little. I don't consider myself cheap, just a good steward of what I have been blessed with.
 
esa17 said:
Exactly! First off, an expensive vehicle doesn't mean you're rich...it means you can make a car payment. Second, I could drive almost anything I want but choose to drive an economical pickup that allows me to haul things, be comfortable, and still get very good gas mileage. Before I bought my new truck in 05 I drove the previous one 190,000 miles over 12 years virtually problem free. If I have my way I'll drive my current one till the wheels fall off too.

The hard part about money isn't getting it, its keeping it.
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:yeahthat: Well said.

In fact, sometimes it means you can't make the car payment. :laff:

(The repo man is coming, the repo man is coming)
 
When I was an FO I used to see how little money I could spend on a 4 day trip....I think my record was 6 bucks, and that was all on van driver tips. I subsisted on leftover catering and a few things I bought from home. For me it was a fun way to save money on trips where none of the overnights were long enough to go out anyway. Instead of eating junk food on those long airport appreciation sits I would walk laps around the terminals.
 
calcapt said:
I remember how much my father brought home every 2 weeks as a steel worker. We lived a very simple but secure life. I never lacked for anything but we never drove new cars or had fancy things.
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:yeahthat:

Sounds like my parents. We never lacked for anything and I went to college without having to worry about paying for anything. Student loans? I didn't even have a clue about what those were until some of my fellow students would talk about how they needed their loans or grants to come in so they could pay for their tuition! I didn't realize what a lucky guy I was until I got to college.

But they weren't the kind of people who bought a new car every five years or who would buy expensive things just to buy them.

That's the kind of person I've grown up to be. Yes, I will spend money on things that I want but you won't see me trading in my car every five years or buying expensive clothes or shoes.

I'm afraid way too many kids are being spoiled by their parents these days and when the world smacks them in the face because they can't afford the things they've taken for granted, it's not going to be pretty.
 
Well, I'm kind of cheap! But I think pilots are much more (or should be a lot more) conscious of the volatility of the profession.

The average salesman, if his company folds, can transfer laterally (at worst) or even move higher vertically at another company.

In aviation, if your company folds, gets merged, loses a contract or someone finally perfects the transporter, game over baby! ;)
 
wheelsup said:
It seems much more prominent with people connected to aviation to be extremely frugal. I'm just wondering why that is. I think it's how we were brought into the industry. For those that didn't work their way into a high paying corporate job via another means - most of us CFI'd for peanuts, worked our way thru first year pay at a freight company, commuter, and/or regional etc. meanwhile facing possible job losses along the way. It's almost like we are brainwashed to be frugal from day 1 :).
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Yeah, I really think that's what it is. In most cases, we work our way through training, or at least have to pay loans and thus value money, as we all should! Some might not value it as much (e.g. spoiled kids who have their parents pay for all their flight training/college/car/etc.) because they haven't been exposed to the value of saving up quarters.

Not that anyone's asking me, but I recently suprised myself with close to $0 in my bank account. I had deposited a small check, but had to rely on change for the weekend while it was getting cleared. You bet I counted all of those quarters, dimes, and nickels! I had to buy food with it. Yup, $0.87 Nissin noodles (lol, yes, I've upgraded from Ramen!).

Things like that make you value what you earn and allow you to live a frugal life. I admire frugal people very much. It's not about being cheap...and yes, like someone said above, being cheap is not pitching in for a pizza or NOT TIPPING WELL AT A RESTAURANT!!! CHEAPOS!!! :p

p.s.- I drive a 1988 Honda Prelude with 193000 miles. $50/month insurance can't be beat! :D
 
calcapt said:
I find myself today making as the same amount in 2 weeks as my father made in a year. I just can't bring myself to throw money away knowing how hard my father worked to support our family on so little. I don't consider myself cheap, just a good steward of what I have been blessed with.
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You know, I have to publicly say, I admire people like this very much, and am always happy to hear of others who think alike. Funny enough, on one of my drunk weekends (I become very opinionated. Don't we all? :p) I was with some of my friends, some of them kinda spoiled, mind you, and ended up giving them a 30 minute (literally) speech on EXACTLY what you just mentioned. I moved from a third-world country, and am making the best of it. It hurts to see people taking things for granted. Like you, I value my father's efforts in helping his son get ahead in life.
 
Funny story. My oldest son remembers well when we didn't have any money when he was growing up. He remembers well the macaroni and cheese dinners three nights in a row with the occasional Top Ramen thrown in. He is closing on a new house soon and is having new carpet put in his old house as he prepares it to sell. I am talking to him on the phone last night and he tells me that he is taking out all the old carpet himself before the carpet layer arrives next week. I ask why and he tells me that he is saving a few dollars by doing that. He has been quite successful and has significantly more money than his dad (me) and yet still does back breaking work to save money that he could comfortably afford to pay. He obviously picked up his frugality from us as necessity dictated it in the past. He never fails to amuse me as I watch how hard he works to save a dollar here and there. Some who know me would say it was as if I were looking in a mirror. I can live with that.
 
Buy (or pick up from the hotel / back seat) the Sunday paper. Do you know how much you can save by using coupons for the products you normally use? It is amazing!!
 
SkyCougar said:
Lloyd makes me laugh. :D
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I just find good looking women who want to buy me dinner!

Why are pilots so cheap? I think its conditioning. All you young regional guys know what you get paid. Its the same when you first start in the military. You have to learn to be cheap to get by. Once, I had to fish 100 pennies out of my change bucket so I could go to the beach and pay the $1 parking fee.

And every time you change jobs, you take a pay cut. I took a 50% pay cut to join the military. I took another 50% pay cut to take my airline job. Then, you never know when an arbitrator will impose a 35% pay cut. So you train yourself to be frugal.

Once you've made Captain, though, its time to pay it forward. I have a personal policy to take my F/Os out for dinner or drinks the first time we fly together. When they ask what they can do, I say, "When you make Captain, you do it for your F/Os."
 
I driive a '89 bmw (I tell them its a '90 lol) and she drives....

I'm just generally broke so... yeah :D
 
Velocipede said:
Once you've made Captain, though, its time to pay it forward. I have a personal policy to take my F/Os out for dinner or drinks the first time we fly together. When they ask what they can do, I say, "When you make Captain, you do it for your F/Os."
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awesome :)
 
AngelFuree said:
You know, I have to publicly say, I admire people like this very much, and am always happy to hear of others who think alike. Funny enough, on one of my drunk weekends (I become very opinionated. Don't we all? :p) I was with some of my friends, some of them kinda spoiled, mind you, and ended up giving them a 30 minute (literally) speech on EXACTLY what you just mentioned. I moved from a third-world country, and am making the best of it. It hurts to see people taking things for granted. Like you, I value my father's efforts in helping his son get ahead in life.
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Totally true! I agree.
 
Velocipede said:
Once you've made Captain, though, its time to pay it forward. I have a personal policy to take my F/Os out for dinner or drinks the first time we fly together. When they ask what they can do, I say, "When you make Captain, you do it for your F/Os."
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:yeahthat:

After learning to be frugal, it's actually pretty hard to get out of, which of course, is a good thing! :nana2:
 
Why wouldn't anybody be frugal? Seriously, I make 45k a year and I can't even qualify for a home loan to move into the hood. Cost of living has gotten WAY out of hand compared to income. How can anybody afford to have children just blows my mind.
 
I'm one of those "spoiled" kids that has their parents paying their way through college. Does it mean I'm not frugal? Hell no! I collect coupons, and not only do I pick up change that I drop, I'll take the time to pick up a penny if I find one. I really appreciate that my parents are helping me get ahead in the world and I actually feel guilty at times. I do know what its like to live on tight money though, because my dad was out of a job for several years when I was younger. My parents also made me get a job and use my own money to buy the things I wanted even though they could have easily bought it for me. I'm glad my parents are now teaching me how to save my money for retirement, and I actually find myself reading articles on 401k's, IRA's, and the stock market from time to time. I guess I've always had a thing for money. :D
 
cmsuav8r said:
I'm one of those "spoiled" kids that has their parents paying their way through college. Does it mean I'm not frugal? Hell no! I collect coupons, and not only do I pick up change that I drop, I'll take the time to pick up a penny if I find one. I really appreciate that my parents are helping me get ahead in the world and I actually feel guilty at times. I do know what its like to live on tight money though, because my dad was out of a job for several years when I was younger. My parents also made me get a job and use my own money to buy the things I wanted even though they could have easily bought it for me. I'm glad my parents are now teaching me how to save my money for retirement, and I actually find myself reading articles on 401k's, IRA's, and the stock market from time to time. I guess I've always had a thing for money. :D
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Excellent, that's a good mindset to have!
I don't rip on students who have their parents helping them. I just rip on those who aren't appreciative of it and don't value the aid they're given.
You probably shouldn't feel guilty of it, though. I plan on helping pay for my future children's education.
 
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