Who can tow gliders?

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Jbroz04 said:
I know theres probably a answer to this somewhere I just am too tired to look it up. My question I guess falls isn't the free flight time flying the Pawnee compensation as far as the FAA is concerned?
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61.113 exempts glider towing from requiring a commercial certificate.

Most glider "clubs" are really just that, clubs. They rely on the members to volunteer their time, wing walking, staging gliders, instructing, and flying the tow plane, etc. Mine charges $40/month for unlimited use of the gliders. Obviously that wouldn't cover expenses if they were paying anyone.

If you want to get paid, go to a commercial operation. You won't get rich doing it anyway. They probably aren't expecting you to fly more than 2 or 3 hours a month anyway.
 
DV8Pilot said:
That's usually an insurance issue for a club.
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Yeah, I meant to say that.

Is it bad that the only reason that I want to come home from college is to tow gliders in the Pawnee? Getting paid a whopping $3 a tow. :)

However, even at $3 a tow, on a really busy day, you might get 25 tows in. $75 a day isnt too bad I guess, but they are only open on weekends. :(
 
Zero1Niner said:
Oh my God...every time... jeeze...

this is a little different situation, dont you think?
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No...you work for free, you are destroying this industry.

Should a Citation II Air-Amb pilot work for free because the company he is working for is a non-profit company?

You do a job, you get paid for it.

Christ and people call me a scab.
 
jhugz said:
You do a job, you get paid for it.

Christ and people call me a scab.
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It's not a "job" if you exchange a little bit of your time towing banners in exchange for someone else towing your gluder for "free" when you need it.


This is entirely different than someone just going to an airport where they tow gliders and volunteering their time just to log the time. This is a club, an organization, where people tow in order to be towed. It's kind of an exchange of time.
 
dc3flyer said:
It's not a "job" if you exchange a little bit of your time towing banners in exchange for someone else towing your gluder for "free" when you need it.


This is entirely different than someone just going to an airport where they tow gliders and volunteering their time just to log the time. This is a club, an organization, where people tow in order to be towed. It's kind of an exchange of time.
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That should be a perk for the job not it's compensation.
 
jhugz said:
Don't work for free...
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I never realized this until I became a Commercial pilot and was about to tow for a soaring club in the bay area. Its the reason companies dont pay us more. There is always somebody willing to build time for free which is all good and well, but we are short changing ourselves in the end.

Another reason the glider towing gig pissed me off was the guy required huge amounts of time. Doesnt make sense for an entry level commercial gig.
 
jhugz said:
No...you work for free, you are destroying this industry.

You do a job, you get paid for it.

Christ and people call me a scab.
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What a load. Nobody in this situation is 'working' for free. This situation is simply a bunch of guys that enjoy flying gliders, and have formed a club where they keep cost down by sharing in the activities that need to be done in order to do so.

This is in NO WAY 'destroying this industry'.
 
Zero1Niner said:
What a load. Nobody in this situation is 'working' for free. This situation is simply a bunch of guys that enjoy flying gliders, and have formed a club where they keep cost down by sharing in the activities that need to be done in order to do so.

This is in NO WAY 'destroying this industry'.
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So is it ok for jump pilots to fly 12 hours a day for no pay as long as they get a couple free jumps? They love what they are doing? Free flight time & Jumps. What a deal...
 
So does this mean I shouldn't pay the club 30,000 up front for the opportunity to tow gliders + a 152 type?
 
jhugz said:
So is it ok for jump pilots to fly 12 hours a day for no pay as long as they get a couple free jumps? They love what they are doing? Free flight time & Jumps. What a deal...
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Actually that would be roughly $400 a day with local tandem jumping pricing which is probably more than you make as a CFI flying 8 hours in a day. Compensation isn't always cash.

The glider club is a club, not a business not an organization. Also since private pilots can fly the aircraft towing the glider, it sounds like this wasn't even a paying job to begin with.

Flying a citation for free would have been a paying job taken away from someone, but glider clubs? I haven't seen many people looking for tow pilots to put on salary.

If anything, glider towing could be a good opportunity for a commercial student to build time with. It would reduce training costs a ton, especially if he could fly the aircraft during the week at the cost of fuel.
 
Now you are just trying to fit in with the "cool kids".

jhugz said:
Yep...not when they can find pilot's for free.

I haven't until recently found Gulfstream looking for FO's.
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Yup, cause Gulfstream sits 60 year old private pilots in the right seat of their B1900's.

You are trying to create a commercial industry out of an industry the doesn't require a commercial certificate. In the FAA's eyes, it isn't a pilot job.
 
Maurus said:
Now you are just trying to fit in with the "cool kids".



Yup, cause Gulfstream sits 60 year old private pilots in the right seat of their B1900's.

You are trying to create a commercial industry out of an industry the doesn't require a commercial certificate. In the FAA's eyes, it isn't a pilot job.
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You are not required to have a commercial ticket to sit in the right seat of a 1900.
 
jhugz said:
You are not required to have a commercial ticket to sit in the right seat of a 1900.
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In the 121 environment you do. The B1900 is a two man crew in the 121 environment. The right seater is logging SIC, turbine, multi, total time.
FAR said:
61.117 Private pilot privileges and limitations: Second in command of aircraft requiring more than one pilot.

top Except as provided in §61.113 of this part, no private pilot may, for compensation or hire, act as second in command of an aircraft that is type certificated for more than one pilot, nor may that pilot act as second in command of such an aircraft that is carrying passengers or property for compensation or hire.
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Unless that private pilot is paying his share or is in a single pilot aircraft they can not be sitting in the right seat of that aircraft and be compensated. Flight time does count toward compensation.

Besides, if a right seater would not be required by insurance in the single pilot aircraft, why hire anyone to sit right seat? If insurance required a right seater, they would follow the above reg.
 
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