Where is the dividing line?

Polar742 said:
It did.

In 1970's it was Beech 99's and Metros (up to 19 seats)

In the 80's it was SAABs and ATRs (up to 66!! seats)

In the 90's it was CRJs and E145s (up to 50 seat jets and still the 66 seat ATR 72s)

In the 2000's it was CRJ-700/900 and EJets and 74 seat Q400s (the next explosive fleet segment BTW, however it won't be as big as the RJs IMO)

Anyone else see a trend?
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Deregulation destroyed the industry?
 
If the name on your badge doesn't match the name on your plane you are at a regional. You are doing some one elses work i.e. subcontracted. Yes it is debatable what "regional" flying is, but you are not at a major if the words connection, airlink, express, lite, or diet appear on your plane.
 
Polar742 said:
It did.

In 1970's it was Beech 99's and Metros (up to 19 seats)

In the 80's it was SAABs and ATRs (up to 66!! seats)

In the 90's it was CRJs and E145s (up to 50 seat jets and still the 66 seat ATR 72s)

In the 2000's it was CRJ-700/900 and EJets and 74 seat Q400s (the next explosive fleet segment BTW, however it won't be as big as the RJs IMO)

Anyone else see a trend?
Click to expand...

Actually you are forgetting when United purchased and spun off Air Wisconsin with there 146's in the early 90's that was the ball breaker of scope. I mean what were the 146's 85-100 seats?
 
WalterSobchak said:
Actually you are forgetting when United purchased and spun off Air Wisconsin with there 146's in the early 90's that was the ball breaker of scope. I mean what were the 146's 85-100 seats?
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When Whiskey had the 146 it was a 100 seat aircraft.

But on topic, realistically everything above 50 seats should be at mainline (there would need to be something regarding seats not turbojet/fan or turboprop). The dream would be everything flown at mainline.
 
IFly85 said:
When Whiskey had the 146 it was a 100 seat aircraft.

But on topic, realistically everything above 50 seats should be at mainline (there would need to be something regarding seats not turbojet/fan or turboprop). The dream would be everything flown at mainline.
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What happens to all the regional pilots then?
 
A-300F4-622R said:
What happens to all the regional pilots then?
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We go work for UPS. :D

Realistically - some regional pilots go work for mainline (right away). Others get all the other lucrative aviation jobs that exist. More others get out of aviation.

The senior guys have been pushing it upon the junior guys for too long. For the junior guys to take it back there has to be a sacrifice... regional jobs. While we're still in existence, the regional guys can attempt to hold onto scope as much as they can to reduce whipsawing and outsourcing of ourselves.

121 flying isn't the end-all-be-all in aviation, so I'm fairly sure that the people that lose their regional jobs will find something.
 
IFly85 said:
When Whiskey had the 146 it was a 100 seat aircraft.

But on topic, realistically everything above 50 seats should be at mainline (there would need to be something regarding seats not turbojet/fan or turboprop). The dream would be everything flown at mainline.
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I don't know if that could have a chance of happening. Once things began going down the regional road airline-wise, there's little that can make it turn back IMO.

Things will be brought down to the regional model before they're raised to the mainline model, IMO. Just seems to be the direction things have been, and are continuing to be going.
 
IFly85 said:
But on topic, realistically everything above 50 seats should be at mainline (there would need to be something regarding seats not turbojet/fan or turboprop). The dream would be everything flown at mainline.
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You realize that was the limit in the past though. It was in the mid-90's. That line has obviously held up well.

The problem is thoughts like this.

As other posters have said, it has nothing to do with the size of the airplane, but the name on the side. Until the majors do what needs to be done to bring all the flying inhouse, it's all done.

I don't see what the difference between a turboprop and a turbojet would make, as I've been at a regional that flew them both. Both operate under Part 121, and have someone else's name on the side.

This problem was ego generated. The offer was always put on the table to fly the airplanes, and has been turned down.

The metros were the camel's nose under the tent, no one had the foresight to see what was coming. If they did, their egos stood in the way because they were above flying "little airplanes". I have been told this by mainliners before.

Oh well....

And Baj, I didn't realize the ATR 72 had 76 seats. Since I think you work for a FedEx feeder, I've heard that FedEx owns and maintains the airplanes. Is that true?

If it is, I find it quite repulsing that the guys at FedEx Express (just to be technically correct) just give away that flying.

At some point the regional (commuter) pilots need to quit the self-loathing act of their jobs, nut up, do what needs to be done to get appropriate work rules and pay.

Just like posted in this thread, or another as they all tend to blend together in one huge whiny bitchfest, there may be thousands that want to start flying at a regional, there are 10s of thousands that want the job at UPS, FedEx or the airline du jour. Whether you are flying a 1900 or a 190, there is no reason not to have good work rules. Pay will be directly correlated to equipment type, as a 2 pilots flying 19 seats can only generate a fraction of the revenue of 2 pilots flying 100, but there is no reason that you should be abused by your company.
 
I'm pretty sure I'd say it has nothing to do with aircraft size so much as range.


Regional implies within the surrounding few states or so.

When the 50 seat jet I fly does things like BNA-MIA or ORD-JAX, I have a hard time thinking of it as "Regional".

When I do ORD-CID or DFW-LBB, that seems a lot more regional to me.

The last time I did real regional flying all the time was in a B-1900D.

I think the real reason we were limited in our range there was because we didn't have a bathroom.
 
I remember taking an Wahington IAD to Houstan IAH flight.

I thought I would be flying United Mainline but nope it's a Shuttle America E-170.
 
Arguing about what 'should' be regional flying is exactly where they want you. The moustaches throw the kids under the bus to protect their contracts, the kids work for peanuts to become moustaches and throw the next litter under the bus, and the grand cycle of life on the African Veldt continues. Its the way of the world.
 
cencal83406 said:
Why 50+ seats? Why not 0+ seats? That is the ultimate goal. All flying for a carrier should be done by its seniority list pilots - not by a contractor.
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Withen reason, yes. Adding the types to a certificate to support all that flying becomes cost prohibitive. The last thing airways wants to deal with is SF340a crews, mx, sched. I doubt a 15yr fo there would want to go be a captain in a 1900
 
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