What's the best way to get on with SWA?

S

SCblur

Well-Known Member
I just got hired on with Ameriflight and am looking forward to some good time building. My long-term goal is to fly for Southwest, but I'm trying to figure out the best (and quickest) way to get there. Their website says 1000hrs. turbine PIC (as well as ATP and 2500TT), but what I'm wondering is, does the type of turbine time matter that much. For example, if I have 1000hrs. turbine in the Beech 99, is that good enough, or do they really prefer/favor the turbine time in the metro/brazillia? I don't know how important it is to go for the type rating in the 1900/brazillia, or if I can be competitive with my 1000 hours of 99 time and an ATP certificate.

Thanks
 
Not sure about competitive mins, but I can tell you they're about 40 pilots fat right now, according to an FO I sat next to on one of their flights a couple weeks ago.

Upgrade is about 10 years right now he said.
 
killbilly said:
Not sure about competitive mins, but I can tell you they're about 40 pilots fat right now, according to an FO I sat next to on one of their flights a couple weeks ago.

Upgrade is about 10 years right now he said.
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That's better than being 200 pilots fat. I heard it was up to that number this past summer.
 
Step one. Acquire 1000TPIC
Step two. Acquire Couger-ish South West Airlines Flight Attendant
Step three. Seal the deal.
Step four. Show up for ground school.
 
ppragman said:
Step one. Acquire 1000TPIC
Step two. Acquire Couger-ish South West Airlines Flight Attendant
Step three. Seal the deal.
Step four. Show up for ground school.
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I have the first three, now let them start hiring!

(Disclaimer: Not cougarish, because my girlfriend is two years younger than me.)

:D
 
SIUav8er said:
I am sure you know this, but they also require a 737 type
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Yeah, I saw that on their website. I figured I'd fork out the cash after they offer me a job.

As for step 2: That's gonna be a hard one to get the wife to sign off on!
 
SCblur said:
I just got hired on with Ameriflight and am looking forward to some good time building. My long-term goal is to fly for Southwest, but I'm trying to figure out the best (and quickest) way to get there. Their website says 1000hrs. turbine PIC (as well as ATP and 2500TT), but what I'm wondering is, does the type of turbine time matter that much. For example, if I have 1000hrs. turbine in the Beech 99, is that good enough, or do they really prefer/favor the turbine time in the metro/brazillia? I don't know how important it is to go for the type rating in the 1900/brazillia, or if I can be competitive with my 1000 hours of 99 time and an ATP certificate.

Thanks
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You just started, and you've already got your eye on the door? I would say a better use of your time right now would be to focus on what it takes to be a pilot for Ameriflight. You've got a way to go before Southwest shows up on your radar; if for no other reason, then what SWA wants now may not have any resemblence to what they will want in 5 or 10 years.

I guess what I am trying to say is focus on what is in front of you right now. Approach it as though it will be the job that defines your career. If you do that with all your endeavors, that is going to go further towards your goal than worrying about what kind of time you need in your logbook. Once you get an ATP, 737 type, and 1000 hours turbine PIC, you will be as competitive as the other 10000 applicants. It's what you do outside of that that will get SWA's attention.
 
skydog2 said:
You just started, and you've already got your eye on the door? I would say a better use of your time right now would be to focus on what it takes to be a pilot for Ameriflight. You've got a way to go before Southwest shows up on your radar; if for no other reason, then what SWA wants now may not have any resemblence to what they will want in 5 or 10 years.

I guess what I am trying to say is focus on what is in front of you right now. Approach it as though it will be the job that defines your career. If you do that with all your endeavors, that is going to go further towards your goal than worrying about what kind of time you need in your logbook. Once you get an ATP, 737 type, and 1000 hours turbine PIC, you will be as competitive as the other 10000 applicants. It's what you do outside of that that will get SWA's attention.
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I certainly do not have my eye on the door. Quite the opposite, I am very excited about the job. I really like AMF, what they stand for, and am looking forward to flying for them. Doing the best job for them is at the top of my priority list. I'm sure I'll be with them for a few years, and that's fine.

All that being said, the fact is there are a million different paths an aviation career can take, so I feel it is important to have long-term goals as well as short-term. SWA is my long-term goal, and that in no way hampers my performance at AMF, but rather affects the decisions I make along the way. The truth is, I've got a wife to support, and will be having children this year. It will be very hard to support them on an AMF salary. In light of that, it stands to reason that my time spent at AMF be purposeful. There are so many options for upgrades/base transfers that it would be too easy to wander around the country chasing upgrades. If I'm going to subject my family to moving and a very low income, I sure as heck want it to be for a good reason, and have something to show for it in the end. Sure, it's a volatile industry. You're right that what SWA wants now and what they want in 5 years can be very different. I can only do the best with the info I have right now. Luck and chance play a large part.

I believe that I can have, and plan for, my long-term goals at the same time as I focus on doing my best work in the here-and-now. I appreciate your comment about what I do 'outside of my logbook' as making me stand out from the other 10,000 qualified applicants. A very good point, and very true. And I agree with you that the quality of work I do now, and the professionalism I show here, will follow me and define me to future prospective employers more than what is in my logbook.
 
Things sure have changed since I was in the market for airline jobs.

1995: "Which commuter do you think you want to work for?"

1995: "Whichever one will hire me!"

---------------------------

1999: "Which majors are you sending your stuff to?"

1999: "All of them. Even the ones in Mexico."
 
skydog2 said:
You just started, and you've already got your eye on the door? I would say a better use of your time right now would be to focus on what it takes to be a pilot for Ameriflight. You've got a way to go before Southwest shows up on your radar; if for no other reason, then what SWA wants now may not have any resemblence to what they will want in 5 or 10 years.

I guess what I am trying to say is focus on what is in front of you right now. Approach it as though it will be the job that defines your career. If you do that with all your endeavors, that is going to go further towards your goal than worrying about what kind of time you need in your logbook. Once you get an ATP, 737 type, and 1000 hours turbine PIC, you will be as competitive as the other 10000 applicants. It's what you do outside of that that will get SWA's attention.
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I get your point, but I do disagree. Nothing wrong with having your eye on the prize! You've got have a plan. The important thing is to be prepared to make changes to your short term plans to make it to your long term goal.

I Agree you should do your best at what you are doing now. As far as the SWA what little I know, if you have the right inside contact, that is what matters most. yes they do require type, but not for the interview. once an offer is made then you need to go get it. from what I hear most of the new hires who are not typed go to higher power http://www.jetcrew.com/ to get it.
At one time they wanted three letters of recommendation from capt's flying 737 or equivalent type(at least that is what i was told).
Keep up the effort, learn as much about SWA as you can, meet as many SWA people as you can!
 
Most of those companies know that it is almost inevitable that you will move on eventually. As long as you don't rub their nose in that fact, they will respect your wishes. There are a few companies out there that want to think that they are above what they really are (and you need to watch what you say), but they are far and few between. That being said, the internet has a way of making just about anyone sound like someone with their priorities mixed up.

SCblur, by the time you're in a position to be competitive for SWA, their preferences could be different. There's just no way to know for sure. The most important flight time is good quality flight time and you'll get that at AmFlight, I'm sure of it. For what it's worth, I've heard of turboprop peeps moving on to SWA in the past and I don't think they cared about what kind of turboprop it was. It's all about the person.
 
Just some info I came across regarding the need for a type. During their last hiring cycle I had some contact with someone there who communicated with the HR/hiring peeps. During that particular time the majority of the pilots who got interviews already had the type rating. However it is not always that way. If they are doing a large expansion/hire cycle then the type is not as critical to get the interview. (Though it always helps I was told.) But at the time, when they had a smaller amount of slots to fill, the type rating was what set you apart in the selection for the interview. Being a checkairman or other leadership experience was helpful too.
 
I may be in the minority here, but requiring the type is still disgraceful methinks. Rationalize how you wish, it isn't right.
 
ZapBrannigan said:
Things sure have changed since I was in the market for airline jobs.
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Exactly.

What I don't understand is why someone has their eye on a *specific* major airline they want to work for (in this case, SWA).

It's like saying "how do I get on with the Lakers? I'm not even interested with the Warriors, or the Pacers, or the Thunder. Just the Lakers." As if it's that simple. As if even getting hired to play for an NBA team isn't tough enough itself, but wanting to only play for one specific team. As asinine as that sounds, that's the same as only gunning to go to one specific major.

I'm like you, Zap. When it's time to apply at the Majors, it's going to be a shotgun approach -- apps go to every one that I meet the mins for, and once job offers start coming in I'll get specific about who I want to work for. Fortunately, Uncle Sam still owns me for a couple more years.

The problem with the OP's way of thinking is that, while SWA is the vogue major airline of choice over the last 5 years, there's no guarantee that they'll even be around when the OP gets to the experience level he needs to apply. There will probably, in fact, be a new 'belle of the ball' that everyone wants to apply to then, and SWA will probably be like United is today.
 
Hacker15e said:
The problem with the OP's way of thinking is that, while SWA is the vogue major airline of choice over the last 5 years, there's no guarantee that they'll even be around when the OP gets to the experience level he needs to apply.
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It's funny that you mention that. I remember when United was THE place to be. Anybody who was anybody was trying to go to work for United Airlines.

  • Southwest, at the time, had comparatively low pay. The narrow-body domestic fleet (with no opportunities for heavy aircraft or international flying) was not particularly desirable.
  • In 1998 the only people who went to work for AirTran were those who couldn't get a job anywhere else (myself included) -- many, many CCAir FOs.
  • JetBlue in 2000 sounded like the name of a new mouthwash.
Remarkable how times have changed. United certainly wasn't the first desirable airline.


  • Eastern Airlines
  • Braniff
  • Pan-Am
  • TWA
Pilots in the late 1960s who were turned down by Braniff and went to work for a little known Utica, New York company called "Mohawk" retired as A330 Captains for US Airways.

Heck -- here's a more up to date example.

Take two pilots:

Both were hired by Chautauqua in January of 1996 as Jetstream 31 FOs. (Chautauqua had about 200 pilots at the time, a bunch of J31s they inherited from PSA and a handful of Saab 340a's)

Pilot A - Left CHQ in 1999 to go to United, was subsequently furloughed -- TWICE and is still looking for a career flying job.

Pilot B - (Who may not even have a college degree) Remained at CHQ -- not by choice but because he wasn't successful at moving on -- and is now an E190 Captain making six figures and with the potential of Airbus flying looming on the horizon.

My opinion? Don't get so wrapped up in "Brand X" that you ignore other opportunities.
 
bike21 said:
I may be in the minority here, but requiring the type is still disgraceful methinks. Rationalize how you wish, it isn't right.
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I agree.

I just recently tried to apply to this job outside of aviation. First thing that was said, "Do you have a TWIC card because you need this before you can even apply?" Me: :confused:, No, how can I get one? "It's $132." That's all that was needed to be said to send me out the door. :dunno: I'm well dressed here maybe I have a large bright green booger sliding out of my nose? ...I had to look it up TWIC- transportation worker identification credential. GREAT! another expensive government scam!
 
Hacker15e said:
There will probably, in fact, be a new 'belle of the ball' that everyone wants to apply to then, and SWA will probably be like United is today.
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ZapBrannigan said:
It's funny that you mention that. I remember when United was THE place to be. Anybody who was anybody was trying to go to work for United Airlines.
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It is no coincidence that I worded it that way.

I run into a lot of airline folk these days in the AF, and I get to hear all kinds of different perspectives on different airlines. One theme that I hear over and over is from United guys....furloughed from United, ex-United, on mil-leave from United....they ALL say that pre -9/11 that was their 'dream job', and that it was the one place above all they wanted to work.

It ends up sounding exactly the same way I hear people talk about SWA right now. To some extent, FedEx and UPS, too.

10 years ago, Brand X was the king of the hill. Today it's someone else. A decade from now it will probably be someone entirely different.

Remember, this is the company that you'll be placing your future in the hands of. Future performance is way more important than past performance.
 
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