What would you do?

[jtrain609]

I had an interesting conversation with Mark about the pay issue inbetween him calling me a • RJ driver.

He made a very good point that with my first year at Express, I'm making second year Colgan pay, and in my second year at Express I'll be making Beech captain pay at Colgan.

 

[JBUCREW]

Hey buddy sorry to hear about things man Im sure it will all work out... Just a side note Boston-Maine airlines (Pan Am Clipper Connction) is hiring FO's for there TTN base. Crappy planes J32's but man its in your backyard check it out.

 

[Seggy]

Not only are you making more than me John, but you have killer work rules.

Crew Scheduling called me today, Sunday, on my off day to cover for a trip. What Bullcrap. Anyway.

Some things I would like to add.

Airdale (and those that commented on this thread) there is a VERY VERY VERY good chance that by the time you are done training at Air Wisconsin you will be based at home for Colgan in the Q. Not only that but you will be in the top FIVE seniority wise for FO on the Q. Not five percent, but top five guys.

So not only would you have a killer QOL being based at home, but you would have a killer schedule.

By going to Air Wisconsin, you will save yourself maybe six months time, IF THAT, from getting to be based at home. Not only that, but if you leave Colgan they will come after you for the training contract you signed. So there goes any savings you would have had by going to Air Willy.

I thought about leaving Colgan three times while I was an FO. First time was to Air Wisconsin, second time was to Skywest, third time was to Big Sky as a street captain. Glad to say, that even though Colgan is what it is, I stayed here.

Suck it up Dave, stay here. You really aren't saving yourself that much time or money by leaving.

 

[Airdale]

Not only that, but if you leave Colgan they will come after you for the training contract you signed. So there goes any savings you would have had by going to Air Willy.

Well, the same can be said about not being able to make the morgage payments. The bank is going to come after my house. As far as I'm concerned, if it comes down to needing to leave here to keep my house - Colgan can kiss my you know what about a training contract. I'd gladly meet them in court with my financial papers in hand, over a whoping $6k at best. I need to make a decision for the financial future of my wife and I. I'd rather incur a bad credit mark for a training contract, as opposed to foreclosure on my house. I wouldn't give Colgan a penny to piss on. They can take their losses, just like I'm taking mine all month with 13hrs of duty and 6hrs of pay. If they really want to pursue legal action, I'd be perfectly ready to make a fool out of them and their ridiculous wages and work hours in front of a court.

 

[Airdale]

Airdale (and those that commented on this thread) there is a VERY VERY VERY good chance that by the time you are done training at Air Wisconsin you will be based at home for Colgan in the Q. Not only that but you will be in the top FIVE seniority wise for FO on the Q. Not five percent, but top five guys.

So not only would you have a killer QOL being based at home, but you would have a killer schedule.

See, but this is you talking. I've inquired about the Q, and was told that I would be able to transition as an FO in November. Then I'm told that I do not hold the seniority for the Q. If the company was planning on putting me in the November Q class, I would have expected a phone call, e-mail or letter by now, its a month and a half away. Talk about piss poor planning.

If I transitioned this year, I would initially be in the top 5, like you state, but I would be stuck right seat for a definite 2 1/2 to 3 years, on Colgan's pathetic Q400/Saab/Beech FO payscale. For what? So that I can upgrade on the Q at EWR? When I could be upgrading on the CRJ in the same amount of time, but making considerably MORE money then Colgan's once again Pathetic Captain payscale.

Mark, I really really do see your point man! Please don't think I've got the SJS-wanna-fly-a-Barbie-Jet-Syndrome. Thats not it at all man! But comparing the situation I'm in and the forecasted outlook of staying here at Colgan just doesn't outweigh the QOL/earning potential of somewhere else.

Just wait until you and Bananapancakes get married and have a house. You'll see how your priorities shift from the sacrificies you're willing to make for your career to quality of life at home and having a house.

 

[Seggy]

Well, the same can be said about not being able to make the morgage payments. The bank is going to come after my house. As far as I'm concerned, if it comes down to needing to leave here to keep my house - Colgan can kiss my you know what about a training contract. I'd gladly meet them in court with my financial papers in hand, over a whoping $6k at best. I need to make a decision for the financial future of my wife and I. I'd rather incur a bad credit mark for a training contract, as opposed to foreclosure on my house. I wouldn't give Colgan a penny to piss on. They can take their losses, just like I'm taking mine all month with 13hrs of duty and 6hrs of pay.

Ok, what about the other stuff I mentioned about you being able to be based in EWR around the same time period if you were to stay?

PS-Did they find you a captain today?

 

[Airdale]

Ok, what about the other stuff I mentioned about you being able to be based in EWR around the same time period if you were to stay?

PS-Did they find you a captain today?

Well that certainly helps with the money I would save, but I've sent e-mails and I've left plenty of messages for Mikey Colgan to try and get a straight answer about my transitioning to the Q400. I've put in a standing bid form, I sent an e-mail to the Crew Scheduling dept. head - and guess what? Nobody wants to return my call, return my e-mail or give me an answer as to whether or not the Q400 is my near future. My distant future, well thats a pretty good possibility. But when I can't get an answer, I interpret my own outlook - and that is that Colgan is as disorganized as the friggin NY Giants. I'm not going to sit on the edge of my seat waiting to hear the news, I'm going to get the hell up and go to another seat. Even you can admit that this place is disorganized as hell, with a serious lack of communication. How can I be told on one hand I'm more then likely in the Nov. class, then hear from a check airman who spoke with someone up in management who says I don't have the seniority?

Yes they found me a Captain. And since they did it last minute, the flight is delayed until 1700. I'm flying with Corky.

 

[Airdale]

Besides, reguardless of whether or not I'm PHL based or EWR based, looking at a 2 1/2 - 3 year upgrade on either side- the pay difference between 2nd yr FO AWAC pay and 2nd-3rd-4th- year FO Colgan pay - is more then enough to easily decide which position is best to sit it.

 

[EDUC8-or]

Can I ask a question of you Colganites? What attracted you to Colgan? There seem to be a bunch of people on here who work there. No union, crappy pay, crappy work rules, training contract, crappy schedules, no block or better, no cancellation pay, etc... I know they have a quick upgrade, but someone with low time could go somewhere else with better work rules and pay and upgrade in the same time frame because they'll need the ATP mins. This isn't meant to be derogatory, I just don't get it.

 

[jtrain609]

Can I ask a question of you Colganites? What attracted you to Colgan? There seem to be a bunch of people on here who work there. No union, crappy pay, crappy work rules, training contract, crappy schedules, no block or better, no cancellation pay, etc... I know they have a quick upgrade, but someone with low time could go somewhere else with better work rules and pay and upgrade in the same time frame because they'll need the ATP mins. This isn't meant to be derogatory, I just don't get it.

Because when I was instructing I was clearing $1,000 a month on a normal month and I had 4 days off per month.

If I had left for Mesa, I would make more like $20,000 a year, have EIGHT days off a month and probably thought to myself, "Oh wow cool I'll upgrade soon."

If I had got the job at Colgan I could have moved home where I wanted to be anyways, had 8+ days off a month, made more than I was instructing and known I would have upgraded as soon as humanly possible.

When you're making horrible wages instructing and working 6-7 days a week, a shop like Colgan looks like a great place to be. When you're coming from another 121 carrier you probably look at it and say, "So...seriously? You guys actually work that much for that little?"

 

[EDUC8-or]

Because when I was instructing I was clearing $1,000 a month on a normal month and I had 4 days off per month.

If I had left for Mesa, I would make more like $20,000 a year, have EIGHT days off a month and probably thought to myself, "Oh wow cool I'll upgrade soon."

If I had got the job at Colgan I could have moved home where I wanted to be anyways, had 8+ days off a month, made more than I was instructing and known I would have upgraded as soon as humanly possible.

When you're making horrible wages instructing and working 6-7 days a week, a shop like Colgan looks like a great place to be. When you're coming from another 121 carrier you probably look at it and say, "So...seriously? You guys actually work that much for that little?"

Sure, but you could just as easily get hired at ExpressJet, ASA, Pinnacle, Piedmont, or Air Wisconsin with the same amount of times. I'm not saying those places are any better or worse, but I haven't heard as many horror stories about them.

 

[jtrain609]

Today you can, but a year ago when I went to Amflight I couldn't get Mesa to touch me with 600/100. A year and a half ago I had a hard enough time finding a flight instructing job.

 

[H46Bubba]

I was really considering Colgan, but with the ALPA drive a failure, and the whipsaw against PNCL just around the corner, I've shelved that idea until hopefully they can get another ALPA vote and get it ratified. I'd go back to Mesa, before I go to Colgan. I keep getting e-mails from Mesa asking me to come back when I get my multi and they'd give me preferential re-hiring since I didn't burn my bridge, though they almost burned it for me. Oh I finally got my last paycheck from Mesa after what almost a year!

Airdale, a lot of good useful advice has been give, now it's up to you to make up your decision. If Air Wiskey is the best option...take it and run with it. It's tough when you got a family and a mortgage to think about when you have to make these decisions. Good luck.

 

[Cruise]

Besides, reguardless of whether or not I'm PHL based or EWR based, looking at a 2 1/2 - 3 year upgrade on either side- the pay difference between 2nd yr FO AWAC pay and 2nd-3rd-4th- year FO Colgan pay - is more then enough to easily decide which position is best to sit it.

Airdale, I think you've been given a ton of advice from many different people. Ultimately, YOU are the one who needs to decide the direction of your future, and I'm sure you're aware of that. For what it's worth, using the information that's out there, it sounds to me like going to AWAC is your best move. If you wind up on reserve for extended periods of time....so what, you can do it at home. One thing is certain though. You need to figure out what you're doing NOW. The sooner you make your decision, the better off you'll be. For the simple reason if you're going to make a switch, get that seniority number ASAP.

Can I ask a question of you Colganites? What attracted you to Colgan? There seem to be a bunch of people on here who work there. No union, crappy pay, crappy work rules, training contract, crappy schedules, no block or better, no cancellation pay, etc... I know they have a quick upgrade, but someone with low time could go somewhere else with better work rules and pay and upgrade in the same time frame because they'll need the ATP mins. This isn't meant to be derogatory, I just don't get it.

My reasoning for coming to Colgan was the domicile in my hometown. I spent nearly my entire time as an FO at home. Pay was bad, but I was home....can't beat that.

Also, some misinformation is out there. I don't think the work rules are terrible. Could things be improved...you betcha! But from what I've heard here on JC, I'd venture to guess the work rules are just as bad (if not worse) at Mesa, PSA, others....and these airlines HAVE contracts. The training contract is a joke....one year....Big deal. If you come here and leave for greener pastures in less than a year......well, that's on you. Also, we DO get block or better. Our cancellation pay is not great....we're paid for Wx Cancellations...but not Mx. Complete BS...but hey, not enough people wanted a voice in their future....DON'T GET ME STARTED ON THAT. I haven't spent a single month flying a "reserve" line. Since I've been here (over two years), I've averaged 96 - 100 hours of credit. Not too shabby! Be even better if our payrate was better.....but not enough people wanted a voice in their future....DON'T GET ME STARTED ON THAT.

So, my experience here at Colgan has been a positive one.

That being said, I want to make it better. For me, for those that follow me, for all pilots in general. But not enough people..........

 

[beechpilot]

I was really considering Colgan, but with the ALPA drive a failure, and the whipsaw against PNCL just around the corner, I've shelved that idea until hopefully they can get another ALPA vote and get it ratified. I'd go back to Mesa, before I go to Colgan. I keep getting e-mails from Mesa asking me to come back when I get my multi and they'd give me preferential re-hiring since I didn't burn my bridge, though they almost burned it for me. Oh I finally got my last paycheck from Mesa after what almost a year!

Airdale, a lot of good useful advice has been give, now it's up to you to make up your decision. If Air Wiskey is the best option...take it and run with it. It's tough when you got a family and a mortgage to think about when you have to make these decisions. Good luck.

I felt the same about Colgan. I was certain thats where I was gonna go but the whole ALPA thing not passing has me looking at others, in particular RAH and AWAC. I wont rule out Colgan cause you never know hows things could be in the future.