What is and what isn't IMC?

Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

Yeah I know, I just typed too fast and had a typo. Thanks for letting me know.
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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So do you log actual time when you cant see in any direction as actual?

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Boy, did that come out the wrong way! It should have read:


So do you log time when you cant see in any direction as actual?
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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So how would airlines and the FAA view logging actual when the weather is clear and a million?

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You probably won't get caught. I mean, after all, think about it. Would they know that it was severe clear on a night that you logged actual?

Highly unlikely, to say the least.

But do you want to do that? You're only cheating yourself!
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

I would think that if you live in Fl, and log most of your time in Fl, someone would take notice if you logged "actual" several times a week regularly. IMC is Instrument Meteorological Conditions, is it not? There's nothing about the ocean that's Meteorological. (unless you consider that is supplies the atmosphere with a lot of the H2O that causes the weather) However, you would be in instrument condidions, would you not? So it should be IC, not IMC. Maybe there should be a new column in the log book??????

So airlines flying over the ocean at night, is that logged IMC? Prob not.
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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So how about, IMC is anytime controlled flight with reference to anything outside the cockpit is not possible.

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Not quite. As mtsu already said, the definition of IMC is weather conditions less than those prescribed for VFR.

You're talking about logging actual, which really just comes down to common sense. If you have to rely on your flight instruments to keep the rolley side down, then log actual. And yes, this DOES include night VMC if you can't see; i.e. over the ocean, desert, etc.
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

I am not thinking about getting "caught." Let me rephrase this: You walk into your interview and tell them "This 20 hours of acutal was all flown in CAVU conditions at night over the ocean." What would they say to that?
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

Take it a step further then... When you do log actual how much do you log? If you fly through one cloud and you are in "actual" (whatever we are going to define it as) for about 3 seconds, is that .1 in the logbook? Or do you just ignore it unless you are in solid IMC for a good amount of time (more then 6 min)? I would think that it has to do with how much time you have and how much you need the numbers in your log book (ie regional job). I know for me, if I hit a few clouds I won't log the actual unless I am in them for a) more then a minute or two or b) unless I am in and out of them for a fair amount of time. Just my .02.

Ethan
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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Personally I think you have to be mad to fly at night over the ocean without an instrument rating and yet it is perfectly legal to do so.

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Angry mad, or Crazy mad? Or both? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

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Your best Bill Murray voice; "Don't fly angry!"
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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I would think that if you live in Fl, and log most of your time in Fl, someone would take notice if you logged "actual" several times a week regularly.

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Never flown in FL during the summer have ya? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I racked up on the actual time while time building for me commercial. Those daily afternoon t-storms combined with covective activity all day long add up to a pretty decent amount of clouds. Now if you lived in AZ and had a lot of actual......
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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Now if you lived in AZ and had a lot of actual......

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Not so fast. Everyone assumes that AZ has very little in the way of actual. You'd really be surprised at what you can dig up around here. Take off from PRC and fly directly west on a moonless night. See anything? Nope! Actual.

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Take it a step further then... When you do log actual how much do you log? If you fly through one cloud and you are in "actual" (whatever we are going to define it as) for about 3 seconds, is that .1 in the logbook?

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I cannot confirm nor deny that comment... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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Not so fast. Everyone assumes that AZ has very little in the way of actual. You'd really be surprised at what you can dig up around here. Take off from PRC and fly directly west on a moonless night. See anything? Nope! Actual.

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Same scenario as the OP P'd, but swapping desert for ocean. Bottom line (IMHO), if there are no outside visual references, you're flying in instrument conditions and you'd better be flying by reference to your instruments, lest ye should pull a JFK Jr. and meet thine untimely demise. I can't think of anyplace in the FARs that says you must be instrument rated to log actual instrument time. You just have to be instrument rated to fly under instrument flight rules.

Your mileage may vary. Widely.
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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Not so fast. Everyone assumes that AZ has very little in the way of actual. You'd really be surprised at what you can dig up around here. Take off from PRC and fly directly west on a moonless night. See anything? Nope! Actual.

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Same scenario as the OP P'd, but swapping desert for ocean. Bottom line (IMHO), if there are no outside visual references, you're flying in instrument conditions and you'd better be flying by reference to your instruments, lest ye should pull a JFK Jr. and meet thine untimely demise. I can't think of anyplace in the FARs that says you must be instrument rated to log actual instrument time. You just have to be instrument rated to fly under instrument flight rules.

Your mileage may vary. Widely.

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JFK jr was murder/suicide camoflauged as instrument incompetency.......
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

If, in your estimation, total actual time during your flight was less than .1, why bother? If you keep going through clouds, and you estimate you spent about 20 % of your flight in actual, you log .2.
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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Not so fast. Everyone assumes that AZ has very little in the way of actual. You'd really be surprised at what you can dig up around here. Take off from PRC and fly directly west on a moonless night. See anything? Nope! Actual.

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Same scenario as the OP P'd, but swapping desert for ocean. Bottom line (IMHO), if there are no outside visual references, you're flying in instrument conditions and you'd better be flying by reference to your instruments, lest ye should pull a JFK Jr. and meet thine untimely demise. I can't think of anyplace in the FARs that says you must be instrument rated to log actual instrument time. You just have to be instrument rated to fly under instrument flight rules.

Your mileage may vary. Widely.

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JFK jr was murder/suicide camoflauged as instrument incompetency.......

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/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Must have been the republicans after him, huh? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Must have been the republicans after him, huh? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

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No way! Can't have been!




The job wasn't botched. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Must have been the republicans after him, huh? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

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No way! Can't have been!




The job wasn't botched. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

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I'll have to go back to the conspiracy website and look......I'll get back to you guys. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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If, in your estimation, totalIf you keep going through clouds, and you estimate you spent about 20 % of your flight in actual, you log .2.

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So if I do 20% of my 9 1/2 hour flight in the clouds, I can only log .2 actual????? Man, I need to hit the math class again!
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

What I neglected to mention before (perhaps out of hunger), is that I was a assuming a one hour flight. You are certainly a sharp man!
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

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I was a assuming a one hour flight

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Never, EVER, assume anything... Cuz we all know what assuming does... /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Re: What is and what isn\'t IMC?

Right, the whole Ass U Me thing.... I was really just trying to cover for being a dimwit when I posted that /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
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