What happens if a student fail's a checkride twice?

"Student bought engagment ring in the morning planed on taking his oral in the afternoon and proposed to his girlfriend that night."

Yikes, sounds like a lot to put on one's plate for one day.

I've encountered students who would purposefully load themselves up with a lot of stuff to do, just so they could have an excuse for when they failed. "Well, I had a lot on my plate today, so that is why I failed."

Well, duh, Sherlock.

If a student fails twice with me, there is something obviously wrong with either the retention, or the teaching method, or he's just pain nervous. I'd just give him to someone else then, and eliminate one of the three variables.
 
Inverted said:
Had my first student failure yesterday. Nerves got him, and some brain farts. I am just worried about a second failure and what would happen to me. He was well within PTS standards during his training. But was just all over the place on the checkride.
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Look at the bright side. You'll get a few more bucks out of the poor chap.

The serious bright side. He'll be a safer pilot from the additional training.
 
It depends. I've seen 709's of CFIs just because they sent a student who was not qualified for a check. I saw a 709 of both the recommending CFI and the applicant for an additional rating on an existing CFI when the applicant was not qualified for the check. The logic was that if between those two CFIs, neither of them could figure out what it took to be qualified for the check, then there was a serious problem. On the other hand, I've seen some really horrible stuff go unnoticed or noticed and uncorrected. It depends on a lot of factors.
 
esa17 said:
Not a chance of that happening.
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Actually if a student fails the same ride three times I believe the instructor that signed him/her off gets looked at. Possible 709 for the IP.

I heard it from a friends dog who saw it on TV.
 
bLizZuE said:
Actually if a student fails the same ride three times I believe the instructor that signed him/her off gets looked at. Possible 709 for the IP.

I heard it from a friends dog who saw it on TV.
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I've seen the same student fail more than three times from the same IP and no one ever got looked at.
 
esa17 said:
I've seen the same student fail more than three times from the same IP and no one ever got looked at.
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I would hazard a guess that it's very dependent on which FSDO you're dealing with.
 
I do know of a guy who failed his CFI initial 7 times. Finally he got it, then crashed a Seneca 4 months later.

By no means am I suggesting that both events could be related.
 
If it's one student we're talking about here, I can't image much happening to the CFI. On the other hand, if the CFI has a regular track record of repeated checkride busts with multiple students outside the norm, that might be cause for concern.
 
Thankfully I've never had this problem. If you suspect that you and your student aren't clicking, the best answer is switching CFIs. I've done that before, both as the CFI handing off and receiving a student. If it gets to checkride and you haven't noticed, then you aren't a very observant CFI.
 
saria19 said:
Thankfully I've never had this problem. If you suspect that you and your student aren't clicking, the best answer is switching CFIs. I've done that before, both as the CFI handing off and receiving a student. If it gets to checkride and you haven't noticed, then you aren't a very observant CFI.
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This is true. Mostly...

I would like to point out one more time that a student's pass or fail on a checkride can be largely outside of the control of the instructor. Now, yes we do play a big role in preparing them, but ultimately the student has to do it themselves. A student can fail a checkride in an instant and for a reason that goes completely against the instructors preparation. This is why I have such a hard time thinking some one is the hotel sierra because they have a 100% checkride. Are you good? Yes but you also had some luck. Am I less of an instructor if my pass rate is around 78? Nope, I'm good too just not as lucky.

Disclaimer, I have no idea what my pass rate is but it's probably around 80 or so.
 
I know I've had some students pull bone-head moves while on checkrides, totally against training. There are also students who are just plain bad at taking tests - especially oral exams.

I would also like to point out to Saria that sometimes, depending on where you work, you don't really have a choice as to who you teach. Sometimes it's a "teach this guy, or we will find someone else who can" type of mentality at the workplace.
 
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