USAF UAV pilot delusional...

O&M said:
Couple more thoughts on this. It seems to me that tthe author was simply advocating for his profession and his community; he was not impugning manned aircraft operations. However, the manned aircraft community felt the need to lay the smack down on the author. Insecure much?
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Yeah, that's what he was doing lol He got what he deserved as most of us who actually fly for the military in some capacity know exactly what he was trying to do. Fine if he wants to lay it on the line but he should expect some repercussions. LOL to your insecure comment as there isn't a single military aviator I know that is, was or ever will be envious of a UAV driver. That's funny, made me laugh..you're a joke maker aren't you :bounce:


O&M said:
Secondly, this whole debate reminds me of the regional vs. mainline debate; which are the "real" pilot? If you want respect, you'd better give some.

Finally, it seems to me that the UAV/RPA is the future of military aviation. The day may come when UAV guys outnumber manned aircraft (kind like the regional vs. mainline scenario). If that happens, well, what goes around comes around. Again, if you want respect, give respect.
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Don't have to give respect those who aren't worthy, it's that simple, end of story. He wants respect, he should know his place as a UAV driver. I respect those who fly, go into harms way, not those who believe they deserve more than what is reality. Is what it is.
 
I think the point is that the guy is being a fool, and in a very un-warrior-like fashion, campaigning for medals and decorations. The fact that said decorations are laughable for someone who fights the war from an air-conditioned double wide just makes it even more ironic and distasteful. But that is secondary to the absurd notion that he is complaining about not getting medals. Who the F cares? Either you are satisfied with the work you do, or you are not, and no amount of chest candy is going to make your life any more meaningful or important. I think those guys do really important work, and from what little I know, they make a big difference. Is that really not enough these days? The guy is missing the point that every single person who flies a military aircraft, from a manned fighter, to a UAV, to a heavy, to a helo, is there for the sole purpose of supporting the troops on the ground. The way they provide this support, and at what level varies, but at the end of the day, none of us are here to be the star of the show.
 
bunk22 said:
Don't have to give respect those who aren't worthy, it's that simple, end of story. He wants respect, he should know his place as a UAV driver. I respect those who fly, go into harms way, not those who believe they deserve more than what is reality. Is what it is.
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I see. A guy who went through the same officer grooming process as you, and who went throught the same pilot training as you, is "not worthy." Nice.
 
O&M said:
I see. A guy who went through the same officer grooming process as you, and who went throught the same pilot training as you, is "not worthy." Nice.
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Nope, not when you write drivel like that, not worthy :) Not everyone is equal, that's life.
 
2 things for you. Maybe 3.

1. The only guys that are in trouble/ can get in to trouble. Are the guys in the hangar working on the drones, and the guys sitting in a shelter with no where to go. The majority of the time you almost have no way of hearing a warning of about incoming. And C-Rams are not prefect. And when the shelter or the hangar is by an area that is targeted on a somewhat regular basis (like the control tower or thunder dome in balad). It only takes one golden morar, rocket, BB, to become minced meat in can. You faster movers have sensors, defenses, and can fight back. I wont know something happened until its happened. Then im sitting next to my SO going "I have to spend eternity with you? DAM IT!".

2. If you are a UAV operator (Pilot, SO, AVO, UFO, Whatever) stateside. I see can see the moments of stress but the ability to safely, efficiently, and product-fully manage said stress when your shift ends. And your support systems kicks in. If you are in country, thats another story. First off, I've watched things in that monitor and heard things on that radio that no man should ever see or hear. And you can do is relay coordinates, try and help keep flow of intel about the area moving, and watch guys carry parts of there buddies off to get evac'd. And that is the only thing you can do, we cant shoot back, we can drop bombs, we just have to sit and watch. Much like some of guys. Tell me that you dont get stressed out by that in some way and ill call you a dam liar. People die in war, bad • happens to the good guys, and sometimes you have a front row seat to the event, even though your miles away. No one dies quietly, and im pretty sure those experiences will stay with me to the end of my days. And im dam sure many of guys on here have had those moments, but as a UAV pilot, myself and others have had them to. Worse when your support systems is across a continent and an ocean. Now do they deserves medals?.........in some cases I can agree. Depending on the circumstances. Just showing up shouldn't get you a promotion.

Disclaimer: Im just a contractor. I write this not as a, my experiences were worse than yours, or to down play what the manned guys do, or up play droner's. There are some similarities if you really look at it. UAV's alone have not won a war yet, who knows if they ever will.
 
exerauflyboy5 said:
Disclaimer: Im just a contractor. I write this not as a, my experiences were worse than yours, or to down play what the manned guys do, or up play droner's. There are some similarities if you really look at it. UAV's alone have not won a war yet, who knows if they ever will.
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Having done the MQ-1B thing, I think what part of the problem is, is that its touted in training as a "video game", and some of the younger crowd begin to see it that way. I saw that with many young Sensor Operators. Its as if they couldn't relate that they are directly, or assisting in, the deaths of people. Sometimes the right people, sometimes the wrong people. It's those who are able to understand that what they're doing and the reality of it (apart from the "detached reality" of UAS ops), who can get stressed over the totality of it. So I try not to judge in certain ways and with certain people. Others, I'll easily judge. Depends on the person. That's just a short synopsis of my thoughts, as I could talk volumes about it. But I can see both sides of the coin in certain ways.
 
///AMG said:
The guy is missing the point that every single person who flies a military aircraft, from a manned fighter, to a UAV, to a heavy, to a helo, is there for the sole purpose of supporting the troops on the ground. The way they provide this support, and at what level varies, but at the end of the day, none of us are here to be the star of the show.
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The job of friendly troops on the ground is to support me in my C-model Eagle, by making ground/parachute/helo assaults on enemy airfields and forcing their planes to take to the air, so I can shoot them down and get MiG kills.





:D
 
MikeD said:
The job of friendly troops on the ground is to support me in my C-model Eagle, by making ground/parachute/helo assaults on enemy airfields and forcing their planes to take to the air, so I can shoot them down and get MiG kills.





:D
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Oh boy, this "logic" is exactly why the Army and Marines take it in the groin when the budgets come out!
 
There are definitely lots of tribes in the military who view themselves with a self-importance that is not supported by their actual relevance to the military objectives and operations at hand.
 
MikeD said:
The job of friendly troops on the ground is to support me in my C-model Eagle, by making ground/parachute/helo assaults on enemy airfields and forcing their planes to take to the air, so I can shoot them down and get MiG kills.





:D
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And I suppose Hornets are just airborne bait then? :(
 
exerauflyboy5 said:
No one dies quietly, and im pretty sure those experiences will stay with me to the end of my days. And im dam sure many of guys on here have had those moments, but as a UAV pilot, myself and others have had them to. Worse when your support systems is across a continent and an ocean.
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Sounds like you guys in the UAS world suffer from 9-1-1 dispatcher syndrome. They say there are two types of dispatchers: Those that have listened to the person on the other end of the phone/radio die, and those that will. I can only imagine watching things unfold on video is even worse. I think the author of the original article is totally wrong, and UAV pilots are absolutely not in the same level of danger (especially the guys who sit half a world away at Creech!). But I think when all is said and done, the psychological effects they take home with them (especially survivor's guilt) are very real and should not be marginalized.
 
inigo88 said:
Sounds like you guys in the UAS world suffer from 9-1-1 dispatcher syndrome. They say there are two types of dispatchers: Those that have listened to the person on the other end of the phone/radio die, and those that will. I can only imagine watching things unfold on video is even worse. I think the author of the original article is totally wrong, and UAV pilots are absolutely not in the same level of danger (especially the guys who sit half a world away at Creech!). But I think when all is said and done, the psychological effects they take home with them (especially survivor's guilt) are very real and should not be marginalized.
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I agree with MikeD's post on the subject earlier -- I know some real, no-kidding hardcore combat pilots who I've been shot at with while flying fighters, who later went into the RPA world. They described psychological stresses that they could not really logically explain because of the "kill bad guy at work, go to kid's soccer game and kiss wife after work" nature of the job. Even worse, they felt embarrassed about experiencing those stresses because they knew how their real-combat-vet compadres in the flying world would view their job and this complaint of stress from the outside. I heard a number of times, "I know it sounds like I'm being a big baby, but...."

I'm not saying those stresses are in any way more important than the real stress (and to the extreme, PTSD) that boots-on-the-ground combat troops experience, but I do believe it is something that needs to be recognized and given the appropriate amount of interest.

Unfortunately, that is not what the guy who wrote the original article in the OP is saying at all. He is being a big baby for an entirely different reason, and one that I don't find legitimate in any way.
 
I'll agree that this guy was being an absolute tool in how he expressed his opinion. However, I do think he has a somwhat valid point in his idea that UAV operators need some viable pathway to decorations that only in-theater flyers get. As an alternative, I'd like to see some new awards created specifically for UAV operators.

I don't think anyone here would disagree that UAV's are only going to become more numerous and relyed upon. Right now, the majority of UAV pilots either come from a manned aircraft or will be going to one after their initial UAV assignment. It is in these manned aircraft that they will have the opportunity to get these combat medals and other decorations that are needed for advancement and promotion. For the small but growing "UAV only" crowd, they'll never get that chance as the system is designed right now.

Every military aviator here knows that there are certain decorations that had better be in your records for promotion to the higher echelons. Without the opportunity to get these awards and decorations, we're truly making UAV operators "second-class citizens" by effectively cutting them out of the competition for higher ranks. In doing so, the AF is going to lose a lot of people with an incredible amount of experience in an entirely new field of warfare. We're already screwing the pooch in the equipment acquisitions sector. Why should we actively do the same thing on the personnel side?

Again, I'm not advocating for UAV guys getting Silver Stars or Purple Hearts without ever stepping foot in the AOR. But we are selling them short when it comes to recognizing and rewarding them for years of watching some pretty horrific things on rotating shifts. Not 120, 180 or 365 day deployments, afterwhich you get to go home, take some time off, and practice making babies. YEARS ON END. Watching everything from kids to soldiers go from living beings to charred and blown apart corpses.

Just some food for thought from a guy who spent a great many hours doing the job.
 
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