Trans-Aero Medical E90 King Air crash

[DE727UPS]

I feel for the crew. They asked about GPS jamming. Wonder what the reply was? ATC is likely to not read page 2547 of the notam, either, but you'd think some heads up between the military and ATC on something like that would be nice.

 

[Roger Roger]

I feel for the crew. They asked about GPS jamming. Wonder what the reply was? ATC is likely to not read page 2547 of the notam, either, but you'd think some heads up between the military and ATC on something like that would be nice.

FWIW when I’ve had gps drop off over that part of the country ATC generally knows it’s going on.

 

[MikeD]

Obviously I only "love"d this because I'm unlikely to get a checkride from you...

Ha! All checkrides, we have to give an inadverent IMC scenario. I always give it to lead to a ground-based approach of some kind….ILS/LOC/VOR, as described above….; then they get a second approach somewhere else that’s GPS-based.

The ground based approach is always raw data, so I know that they can go back to basics of either green needles and nav frequencies, or basic six-pack usage (for the non glass birds). The GPS-based approach is where I can see that they can load up a clearance as a flight plan in the Garmin along with an approach procedure, build/brief/bug it, and execute the magenta. Always make sure to take them to airports they haven’t been to and approaches they haven’t seen, hence why my rides are longer than the other check pilots, due to the cruise time to get to the airports and approaches that no one goes and does normally, like to garden spots such as Gila Bend.

feel for the crew. They asked about GPS jamming. Wonder what the reply was? ATC is likely to not read page 2547 of the notam, either, but you'd think some heads up between the military and ATC on something like that would be nice.

FWIW when I’ve had gps drop off over that part of the country ATC generally knows it’s going on.

Agreed. It’s an ongoing NOTAM with various active times from out of White Sands there. Cherokee control lets ZAB know when it’s going on and active. To what degree jamming testing is being done, or what specifically is being analyzed, ie-partial, full spectrum, or something else, and whether they can limit the affected radius of it from the source, I do not know. I do know that our jets had an early anti-jam/spoof software cape of some kind that was being tested/used. I was based out there for 3 years, 20 years ago, and the testing was being done back then too. I never thought during the times I was working in the ATC tower to pick up the landline and give a call to Cherokee and ask what exactly they were doing, if they could even say or if they even knew, but it was just one of a number of weird test programs going on out there at the time, stuff I wasn’t read into due to having no need to know.

 

[DropTank]

Presently, and more so in the near future, flight crews need to be prepared to complete a flight during a complete GPS failure in a non-RADAR environment.

The time to brush up on VOR ops and Mandatory Reporting Points is now.

 

[Richman]

Airbuses HAAAAAATE GPS jamming becuse it causes cascading errors and ECAMS.

It appers the military does it with reckless abandon and there needs to be a conversation about it.

Good thing we have a multi-chain LORAN network already established that can act as a backup….oh wait.

Well, hopefully there’s a MON VOR somewhere, or a at least a compass locator.

 

[ahw01]

Good thing we have a multi-chain LORAN network already established that can act as a backup….oh wait.

Well, hopefully there’s a MON VOR somewhere, or a at least a compass locator.

Think it’s just domestic, time for IRS…

 

[Cessnaflyer]

Good thing we have a multi-chain LORAN network already established that can act as a backup….oh wait.

Well, hopefully there’s a MON VOR somewhere, or a at least a compass locator.

I read in one of our documents that the Iranians were jamming or sending false VOR signals as well and we couldn’t use DME/DME or VOR backup for the INS.

 

[ahw01]

I read in one of our documents that the Iranians were jamming or sending false VOR signals as well and we couldn’t use DME/DME or VOR backup for the INS.

Exactly VOR and DME are spoofable, so just go IRS

 

[DropTank]

"Stop pissing, Yuri. Give me a stopwatch and a map, and I'll fly the Alps in a plane with no windows."