To all Professional Pilots

Big problem with a college degree is that it preps you for a job.

No one who has a job sits in the back of a corporate jet! Only owners back there ...
 
EatSleepFly said:
Nice. That is one of the biggest loads of bull$hit I've ever read. I just love you holier-than-thou degree thumpers. :whatever:
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Hey, people without degrees can do well in life too, and that wasn't a dig on any regional pilots out there, I am just taking into consideration this "cheaper is better attitude" that the airlines seem to be moving toward.

Seriously think about it. Take Mesa for example, who seems to do everything on the cheap. Do you think they would rather hire someone who can say "screw this, I'm not putting up with their crap anymore, I quit" or someone who puts up with their degrading work rules and can't possibly find another job out there that pays better than their low salary for flying their RJ? I could be wrong, I hope I am... But if not, it really sucks!
 
SkyWChris said:
As one who actually does some of the hiring at a regional, I know for sure, first hand that this is not the case. I like seeing a college degree on a resume. If I had to choose between two equally qualified pilots, one with a degree and one without, I'll choose the college graduate. I think online degrees are fine.
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This is what I always have heard about in this industry until the last year or so. When I decided I wanted to be a pilot I knew that a degree was requirement #1 so I went after it and worried about the flying thing later. You are speaking as a common sense person though who is looking for the BEST and sharpest candidate to trust with the lives of many customers. When the bean counters actually make the final decisions though, are they thinking who they can get the cheapest or who is the best overall candidate to add to their company?
 
Mr_Creepy said:
No one who has a job sits in the back of a corporate jet! Only owners back there ...
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Really? I'll have to talk to my buddy at Gannett. He says they get folks down in the director levels flying back there, but maybe he's wrong.

And as much stock as the CEO owns, it's still chump change compared to the company and it's still a job for him.
 
"When the bean counters actually make the final decisions though, are they thinking who they can get the cheapest or who is the best overall candidate to add to their company?"

Well...at Skywest, it seems, the bean counters don't hire pilots. The antithesis of Skywest is Gulfstream, where the bean counters not only hire pilots but created an airline to make money off of pilots.

So, while I'll agree with your premise that the least qualified pilots are most likely to stick around a while, it seems that the bean counters don't outweigh the common sense pilot interviewers who like to see certain levels of previous experience in new recruits. That's a good thing, I think.
 
I would have not gone to you know WHO! I'd be a richer man by now for sure.:( God forbid I leave now, The loan will drive me to the poor house.
I would have found an fbo and found a starving flight instructor like myself and fed him well with lots of booze for free flight training. I am sure I could find a starving instructor SOMEWHERE that wants hours.
 
DE727UPS said:
Well...at Skywest, it seems, the bean counters don't hire pilots. The antithesis of Skywest is Gulfstream, where the bean counters not only hire pilots but created an airline to make money off of pilots.

So, while I'll agree with your premise that the least qualified pilots are most likely to stick around a while, it seems that the bean counters don't outweigh the common sense pilot interviewers who like to see certain levels of previous experience in new recruits. That's a good thing, I think.
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What if Mesa's practices become the norm in the industry though. Skywest is obviously different and everyone I know that has been hired there has a degree so it seems they are doing it right. But eventually if Mesa is able to get people in at cheaper and cheaper rates they will be able to underbid every other company and the good ones like Skywest out in the cold.

Dare I say it, Mesa could be the only regional left after a while. Either that, or everyone stoops down to what Mesa does.

Alright, I think I am beating a dead horse here...
 
DE727UPS said:
The antithesis of Skywest is Gulfstream, where the bean counters not only hire pilots but created an airline to make money off of pilots.
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...and folks on the scablist write glowing recommendations of the school...

Maybe one day newbies will wake up.
 
tonyw said:
Really? I'll have to talk to my buddy at Gannett. He says they get folks down in the director levels flying back there, but maybe he's wrong.

And as much stock as the CEO owns, it's still chump change compared to the company and it's still a job for him.
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You said it right there Tonyw "as much stock as the CEO owns ..."

But I stand by my point. You don't get in the back of a corporate jet working for someone else.
 
Bandit_Driver said:
How fast this industry was going to turn to S&!t. Secondly, I would not have attended a Major University for an aviation degree. I would have gone after a degree in another field as a backup and done my training part 61 and saved a bunch of cash. But hindsight is always 20/20. What the heck can you do with and a BS in Aviation Flight Science besides fly planes?:banghead:
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that is why i am pursueing Aviation Management, but also getting all my ratings:nana2:
 
Mr_Creepy said:
You said it right there Tonyw "as much stock as the CEO owns ..."

But I stand by my point. You don't get in the back of a corporate jet working for someone else.
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What about the CEO's administrative assistant? :)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Creepy
No one who has a job sits in the back of a corporate jet! Only owners back there ...

tonyw said:
Really? I'll have to talk to my buddy at Gannett. He says they get folks down in the director levels flying back there, but maybe he's wrong.

And as much stock as the CEO owns, it's still chump change compared to the company and it's still a job for him.
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Job...What's you definition of a job? I work at a Fortune 100 company and I know for a fact that like Tony said, there are people in the Director level and even below that use the jet on a regular basis. We have two Citations (6 & 7) and a King Air as well.

Shoot...I only work in the Data Center and I have ridden on the jet my self. I knew the jet was being used for our department so I called the chief pilot to see if I could make the trip. Just like that I was making the trip to St. Louis. Granted it was a 1 a.m. trip but it was just the two pilots and myself. Once the seatbelt sign was off, the pilots let me move right up front and watch everything that was happening. Super Cool. I know it may be like whoopty-Do from someone that already does it for a living, but nothing beats seeing the sunrise from FL430.
 
JEP said:
Job...What's you definition of a job? I work at a Fortune 100 company and I know for a fact that like Tony said, there are people in the Director level and even below that use the jet on a regular basis. We have two Citations (6 & 7) and a King Air as well.
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:yeahthat:

I have several corporate clients with jets, and I ridden a few times with people as low on the pole as HR directors and even HR generalists. The company with a jet just cares about the most efficient way to get its people around. If the jet isn't being used, and a group of people have to get somewhere for company business, the jet goes. It has little to do with rank (as long as the CEO doesn't need it, of course).
 
JEP said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Creepy
No one who has a job sits in the back of a corporate jet! Only owners back there ...



Job...What's you definition of a job? I work at a Fortune 100 company and I know for a fact that like Tony said, there are people in the Director level and even below that use the jet on a regular basis. We have two Citations (6 & 7) and a King Air as well.

Shoot...I only work in the Data Center and I have ridden on the jet my self. I knew the jet was being used for our department so I called the chief pilot to see if I could make the trip. Just like that I was making the trip to St. Louis. Granted it was a 1 a.m. trip but it was just the two pilots and myself. Once the seatbelt sign was off, the pilots let me move right up front and watch everything that was happening. Super Cool. I know it may be like whoopty-Do from someone that already does it for a living, but nothing beats seeing the sunrise from FL430.
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Yeah but you have to ask.

The owner does not have to ask
 
Mr_Creepy said:
You said it right there Tonyw "as much stock as the CEO owns ..."

But I stand by my point. You don't get in the back of a corporate jet working for someone else.
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Well, you're wrong. I just told you -- there are director level people, as in director of marketing, director of communications, etc -- who ARE working for Gannett sitting in the back of the corporate jet.

And who does the CEO work for? The shareholders, right? Guess who owns the company? Not him.

Now, if you want to delude yourself into thinking the only way to make money is to start your own company, go ahead. But I think that Jeff Immelt made a hell of a lot more money working for GE than you did -- cleared about 16 million last year, and I don't think you are doing that well.
 
No not 16 million. Not yet.

But let's see what happens next year :)

Gawd can you imagine what that guy paid in taxes on 16 mil of W-2 income?

Sheesh
 
Boy you guys can get off on a tangent.


To answer the original question. Go to a state supported college/university and get your degree. (they are cheaper) Get the degree in what ever interests you. During you first two summers get all of your rating. Join the flying club etc. and teach you last 2 or 3 years. When you graduate you should have the time to get on with the next step. Do not spend the cash on an aviation college. They are just to expensive. I wish this is what I had done.

Remember the shortest route to you goal is not always the most apparent.
 
B767Driver said:
2. The difference between a good crewmember and a bad one (i.e. is this captain exhibiting normal professional behavior? or is he out of normal professional behavior?) This may sound obvious...but when you are a new crewmember it can be difficult to judge, easy to succumb to unprofessional behavior, or difficult to challenge a more experienced crewmember .
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That's a great point. Especially for people who end up sitting reserve right out of training, you fly with so many different people. Some are good and some are not so good, but it is very hard to tell when somebody is just trying to keep it fun and when they are being unprofessional.
 
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