Theres no such thing as a multi engine trainer/fast airplane.

[mrivc211]

Well it seems as though I might be in luck in the near future here. My brother and his friend are thinking of buying a twin. His friend has owned severl airplanes-C172's, Skymasters, etc. The guy owns a business in costa mesa, CA where he buys 747's 727's etc breaks them apart and sell them for parts. Has his own mechanics and the whole nine yards. Well my brother and this guy were friends long before they both hit it rich and are now thinking of buying a twin in which they would both fly on the weekends to Vegas or Santa Barbara etc. They have asked me my opinion on which plane they should buy because they have said I would be able to fly the plane when they woulndt be using it.(My brother is really going into this 40% for himself and 60% for me to build twin time).

Now heres the debate.

Go with a Pice of SHIIT Seminole so we can put it on lease back with the school and get back a few hundred $$$'s a month, or go for a C310 or something and just keep it outright?

It sucks because you can't have both a trainer and a plane thats fast, and is a true six seater. By that I mean, some planes can hold 6 but you wouldn't be able to load them with fuel and bags. A 310 you can.

Any opinions on what type of plane to go for?

They're budget is around the 150K mark.

 

[pilot602]

Aztec! All the way!

It's not quite as fast as a 310 but it'll carry a helluva a lot more, they're easier to get insurance for and they're built like a truck.

And screw the leaseback - they rarely break even for the owner of the A/C let alone turn any kind of profit.

 

[DrBenny]

IMHO, I think you are making a big jump when you go from a Seminole to a 310. I like the idea of an Aztruck or Sennie. They're good, stable planes, and a good compromise between speed, range, loading, and operating cost. If I had the money (and hours) I'd be getting one of those. The 310 has too many gotchas for me.

 

[MikeD]

You want a fast twin? Get a Piper PA-60 Aerostar.

 

[Hawk]

I 2nd the Aerostar... Short wings -- fast... Good hauler. A tad bit more than 150k though.....

 

[Acadia]

The other question to ask is what can you get insured to fly?

 

[RiddlePilot]

Maybe look into getting a 1980-1981 Turbo Seminole. They'll grab around a 1500-1600 fpm initial climb rate down at sea level, keep up about 1200 fpm above 11,000 at 110 indicated. And you get a nice 15,000 ft or so SE service ceiling. Try that with normally aspirated! They're not as entertaining as a 310 would probably be, but you can have some fun with a published descent speed of 165...

 

[Lee D]

The bulk of my twin time is in Seneca's & 310's. (With a few hours in a Baron and a few in a 414.

Seneca's are a nice balance between trainer and the higher performance twins like Barons and 310's. You can usually load 4 and full fuel with little problems. (Though I've noticed that the later models seem to have worse full fuel payloads than the older models.) 5 or 6 maybe if you balance the fuel or if the passengers are small. Cruise ranges are 150 and up, depending on the model. Plus insurance may be less of a hassle then on somthing more beefy.

A 310 with the 260 hp engines and stabilator tip tanks will haul a decent load and cruise around 170 to 180 kias. (Full fuel payload is about 1000 or 1200 with just the mains full w/no fuel in aux tanks. Still about 3 hours of flying.) That's 5 or 6 regular people!

You can train in a 310, but it would be more challenging then a Seminole or Seneca, though I do know some pilots who have completed twin ratings in 310's. The critical engine has more HP than most trainers, so engine out is a little more work. And the plane seems more fit for cruising than training. Some don't have oil acumulators and that makes air restarts hard, though not impossible. If you already have a twin rating but not much time beyond what was needed to get your rating, a 310 will probably be a fairly uneventful transition. (I would expect at least around 5 to 10 hours dual before you feel comfortable enough to fly alone.)

 

[mrivc211]

Thanks for the info guys.

I just got the email and it looks as though were going for the 310. We've found one in florida and the mechanic is on his way to check it out. The left engine has 22 horus on it and the right has 1300. Both props have around 800 hours. The plane has been owned by a lawyer and well maintained. He's asking $129,500 and weve knocked him down to $110,000. The icing on the cake is he has some sort of TCAS on it that I'm not familiar with that costs $21,000 alone. That would come real handy in the southern california basin. Wow, I thought it would be at least 5-7 years before I would be saying, "yeah we're picking up the traffic on TCAS! lol, well i'm not gonna jump the gun too soon but lets cross our fingers.

If this turns out to happen, I would still be looking at spending at least $60-70 an hour on fuel.

Another thing that I just realized is I could rack up quite a few hours ferrying the plane over here!!!!!!!!! No way this is gonna happen.

 

[John_Doe]

Look into the landing gear very closely. I've heard that there is an AD on the gear and that if it hasn't been complied with, it could cost you around 14,000 extra to get into compliance.

Also, a 310 at my airport had a cylinder vibrate almost completely off. The nuts on the cylider look identical, but are specific as to which stud they go on.

Although the 310 is a sexy looking airplane, I second the Aztec.

Good luck.