SWA TA Discussion

[ZapBrannigan]

Figured I would start a thread discussing the new TA and anything that jumps out. As you know, hourly rates alone do not represent the true value of a CBA.

For example, reserves will work 15 days a month (1 day less than current contract) vs. 18 at OAL's.... 3 day difference per month. Over the course of a single year, that's equivalent to more than a month off.

Thats pretty big. Time with our loved ones is, after all, the ultimate currency. Once it’s gone it can’t be replaced.

 

[bimmerphile]

yeah but isn’t it all shortcall?

 

[ZapBrannigan]

yeah but isn’t it all shortcall?

It’s a hybrid short and long call. Which is absolutely unfortunate if you’re a commuter. Ask me how I know. But since the majority of trips are awarded at 9am the day prior, and under the new contract you are released until report, you don’t need to commute in for the start of your RAP.

Also true that SWA uses its reserves to cover open time more than other airlines. It’s rare to sit reserve and go unused, although it does happen from time to time.

On the up side, there is a daily guarantee. 6TFP if you aren’t called. Minimum of 6.5 if you are. This is from the current contract btw. It prevents scheduling from flying you hard until you hit guarantee and then having you sit the last week of your reserve block for free. That can never happen at WN.

 

[thevideographer]

yeah but isn’t it all shortcall?

and 12h long call, it doesn't look like they got 14/16/18 which is now industry standard.

 

[Crockrocket94]

Zap, I know youre a hard yes because of the sunshades starting Q2 2024!

Retirement and Medical are pretty damn good.

Cap pay rates are not where we wanted, but they are not dumpster rates either.

The one thing we have is a higher ADG rig, so even with a slightly lower hourly rate we can make it up through rigs etc. Lots to digest with work rules but most of it is pretty good with a few exceptions.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

Zap, I know youre a hard yes because of the sunshades starting Q2 2024!

Retirement and Medical are pretty damn good.

Cap pay rates are not where we wanted, but they are not dumpster rates either.

The one thing we have is a higher ADG rig, so even with a slightly lower hourly rate we can make it up through rigs etc. Lots to digest with work rules but most of it is pretty good with a few exceptions.

Leaving the manufacturers sunshades installed on new deliveries does seem like a minor win… gotta admit.

 

[alaskadrifter]

Figured I would start a thread discussing the new TA and anything that jumps out. As you know, hourly rates alone do not represent the true value of a CBA.

For example, reserves will work 15 days a month (1 day less than current contract) vs. 18 at OAL's.... 3 day difference per month. Over the course of a single year, that's equivalent to more than a month off.

Thats pretty big. Time with our loved ones is, after all, the ultimate currency. Once it’s gone it can’t be replaced.

What’s the earliest they can make you show on day 1 of reserve?

 

[ZapBrannigan]

What’s the earliest they can make you show on day 1 of reserve?

Earliest I've seen is a RAP starting at 3:05am. That would mean a show of 5:05 for a departure of 6:05.

 

[DE727UPS]

I'm happy your happy Zap. You could write a book on the downsides of this career (perhaps already did if one uses the search function). Glad you got to the left seat and the hourly rates look pretty good down the road. SWA always had the nicest Capts and F/A's when I groveled for the jumpseat after being up all night. Much appreciated.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

I'm happy your happy Zap. You could write a book on the downsides of this career (perhaps already did if one uses the search function). Glad you got to the left seat and the hourly rates look pretty good down the road. SWA always had the nicest Capts and F/A's when I groveled for the jumpseat after being up all night. Much appreciated.

Thank you. It’s not perfect (they never are) but I’m finding it hard to find things to complain about. We’ll see whether 11000 of my colleagues agree in about a month.

 

[Kingairer]

Thank you. It’s not perfect (they never are) but I’m finding it hard to find things to complain about. We’ll see whether 11000 of my colleagues agree in about a month.

Go ahead and buy the car, itll pass. Turds, Slap in the face, shoved down our throats etc...but itll pass easily.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

Go ahead and buy the car, itll pass. Turds, Slap in the face, shoved down our throats etc...but itll pass easily.

No car for me. We’ll use the retro to help pay for the kid’s first semester of college.
airport car will have to keep going for a bit longer.

How about you? Plans for your retro?

 

[Kingairer]

No car for me. We’ll use the retro to help pay for the kid’s first semester of college.
airport car will have to keep going for a bit longer.

How about you? Plans for your retro?

Just bank and simple investments for now. The real enjoyable part of this has been the money increase on top of the retro/bonus. Because of the extra hourly increase you dont need to touch the bonus.

 

[Flyinthrew]

Go ahead and buy the car, itll pass. Turds, Slap in the face, shoved down our throats etc...but itll pass easily.

If there were ever a TA bumper sticker…

Leaving the manufacturers sunshades installed on new deliveries does seem like a minor win… gotta admit.

What could they have possibly been doing before now?

 

[Flyinthrew]

Retirement and Medical are pretty damn good.

Cap pay rates are not where we wanted, but they are not dumpster rates either.

The one thing we have is a higher ADG rig, so even with a slightly lower hourly rate we can make it up through rigs etc. Lots to digest with work rules but most of it is pretty good with a few exceptions.

Capt rates are above legacy rates. What were you shooting for? Is there truth to the statement I saw about trying to get something comparable to widebody rates?

What does the retirement look like? Better than 17 or 18% DC?

 

[trafficinsight]

Capt rates are above legacy rates. What were you shooting for? Is there truth to the statement I saw about trying to get something comparable to widebody rates?

What does the retirement look like? Better than 17 or 18% DC?

Eventually up to 18% and I guess 2% in a MBCBP but I gotta admit I have no clue what any of that means yet.

 

[Flyinthrew]

Eventually up to 18% and I guess 2% in a MBCBP but I gotta admit I have no clue what any of that means yet.

We got our MBCBP this year. It’s basically a place that 401k contributions spill to that is tax sheltered once you hit the 401k max. The returns aren’t stellar, but they cannot go negative. You need to roll it somewhere else when you retire because it’s not a 401k or IRA.

The typical, disgustingly overemotional crowd here was loudly against it. However, speaking strictly for us, you’d you have to make some crazy massive return to beat the tax savings. Nearly anybody who opted out who didn’t already have a very successful outside business is shooting themselves in the face.

YMMV yada yada yada.

 

[///AMG]

Capt rates are above legacy rates. What were you shooting for? Is there truth to the statement I saw about trying to get something comparable to widebody rates?

What does the retirement look like? Better than 17 or 18% DC?

I heard they wanted your 7ER rates. Argument being that they fly a lot of legs every day, thus carry similar numbers of passengers safely. Maybe someone can correct that if I'm wrong.

I do have a question though, is that only 2% DC once spillover applies, or what?

 

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

We got our MBCBP this year. It’s basically a place that 401k contributions spill to that is tax sheltered once you hit the 401k max. The returns aren’t stellar, but they cannot go negative. You need to roll it somewhere else when you retire because it’s not a 401k or IRA.

The typical, disgustingly overemotional crowd here was loudly against it. However, speaking strictly for us, you’d you have to make some crazy massive return to beat the tax savings. Nearly anybody who opted out who didn’t already have a very successful outside business is shooting themselves in the face.

YMMV yada yada yada.

We're gonna vote for a MBCBP at our shop. It's gonna pass.


Frankly, at my age, I'd still rather get the spillover cash despite the Fed, state, medicare, and ALPA dues. I have better plans for that money now versus retirement.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

The MBCBP at SWA isn't just for spill cash. By 2026 the company will also be putting 2% in there each year. That brings the total retirement contribution to 20%. Of course we can choose to put spill cash there too.

Also profit sharing is a qualified plan at SWA - if we ever start making a profit again.

There's a good video about how it all works together on the SWAPA YouTube page.