Godzgreatgift
New Member
Speaking of First Class Medicals at ATP, I have a First Class Medical on paper but it's definitely downgraded to second class medical certificate. Is that still ok to start ATP even though I'm downgraded to second class?
Starting ATP March!
- Thread starter tiredofshoveling
- Start date
Teller1900
Well-Known Member
Yup. They just require that it be issued as a 1st class so you know you can get one and don't spend all that money only to find out you fail your medical.
Careful!!! Be prepared to be treated horribly by dispatch. And even if you meet every requirement, have all writens done in time and are doing a great job; Jim Kisarski will stick call you and tell you that you will not be allowed to go to cfi school. It happened to me, and the only answer that i could get was "I can kick you out at any time for any reason",. If you forfieght your deposit, you would be saving money because this program is a scam!!!!!
Godzgreatgift
New Member
Yikes, now I'm having ALOT of doubts about ATP JAX facility. Is this true? Anyone who has attended the JAX facility can any1 shed some light on this? I mean I've heard a lot of good things about ATP your like the ONLY person to ever say something like that on JC. With all due respect, maybe it was something you did that they felt they had to let you go?
Nope, I had completed everything on time and complied with all the demands they place on you. I wasn't working there, so i couldn't be let go. They just told me i wasn't allowed to go to the cfi school. I am not the only one. Had a roomate who wasn't told when his checkride was due to an instructors failure to do so, and he missed the checkride and jim kisarski called him up and kicked him out of the program. This guy had no clue when his check ride was!! I personally had a bad taste in my mouth when i left the jax facility. The people there made you feel like you needed to walk on egg shells. The problem with that is, YOU ARE PAYING THEM!! I was also told in the program that i couldn't pull the "customer card" on them because they "already had your money, so we don't care". And the housing is below code and they won't do anything about it. Dispatch (Marty) and Jim Kisarsky treat people like dirt bags, and they don't care. By far the worst customer care of any company i have ever seen!!
Godzgreatgift
New Member
Are you suggesting then that it is better off to do the CFI school and the ACPP program at another location other than the JAX facility?
Take what that guy is saying with a grain of salt. I know for a fact that his experience at JAX is atypical.
Clocks
Well-Known Member
If you go just treat the admin people with the same respect you'll treat your future employers. Yeah you're paying them, but they hold all the cards. Mad your CFI sucks and wont give you ground school? You can call/email Jim K and say:
a) "Jim this program sucks my stupid CFI isn't doing crap, I'm a PAYING CUSTOMER you have to do what I want!" (I've seen stuff worse than this documented on people's accounts)
b) "Jim, thank you for your time, I'm concerned about the ground schooling. I know I'm supposed to be receiving X hours before my checkride which is next week, but my CFI seems so busy we haven't met yet. Is there anything I can do or should be doing differently?".
Option A gets you a bad label and everything you say is documented. Option B might get you no where, but at least your not a "problem" (and it's also how professionals speak to each other, you don't yell, or be sarcastic, or make demands, you might want to get used to it now). If you're not mature enough to do option B even when you are stressed out and pissed off, then you have a problem.
As a CFI I screwed up twice (pretty significantly, and while we were overstaffed on CFIs). I called Jim K immediately (once at 2am) and fessed up. The response? "Thank you for calling, just don't do it again".
a) "Jim this program sucks my stupid CFI isn't doing crap, I'm a PAYING CUSTOMER you have to do what I want!" (I've seen stuff worse than this documented on people's accounts)
b) "Jim, thank you for your time, I'm concerned about the ground schooling. I know I'm supposed to be receiving X hours before my checkride which is next week, but my CFI seems so busy we haven't met yet. Is there anything I can do or should be doing differently?".
Option A gets you a bad label and everything you say is documented. Option B might get you no where, but at least your not a "problem" (and it's also how professionals speak to each other, you don't yell, or be sarcastic, or make demands, you might want to get used to it now). If you're not mature enough to do option B even when you are stressed out and pissed off, then you have a problem.
As a CFI I screwed up twice (pretty significantly, and while we were overstaffed on CFIs). I called Jim K immediately (once at 2am) and fessed up. The response? "Thank you for calling, just don't do it again".
Well 2 things with the last.
First, not all of us want to be cfi's for ATP. And my employers have not treated me with the disrespect of Jim K and Marty.
Second, I researched ATP before I attended. From about the second week on I wished that someone would have posted something to let me know that I would be paying $55grand to be treated horrible. To have management let me know that they are going to treat me like they want, with zero customer service skill, and keep a huge portoion of my money if i didn't go along with it.
If a paying customer buys a mercedes and has a salesmen piss on the seat and then tell you to deal with it or he will keep the car and your money. Well thats a pretty good analogy of the way I was treated.
First, not all of us want to be cfi's for ATP. And my employers have not treated me with the disrespect of Jim K and Marty.
Second, I researched ATP before I attended. From about the second week on I wished that someone would have posted something to let me know that I would be paying $55grand to be treated horrible. To have management let me know that they are going to treat me like they want, with zero customer service skill, and keep a huge portoion of my money if i didn't go along with it.
If a paying customer buys a mercedes and has a salesmen piss on the seat and then tell you to deal with it or he will keep the car and your money. Well thats a pretty good analogy of the way I was treated.
killbilly
Vocals, Lyrics, Triangle, Washboard, Kittens
Question for you, please.
If you did not want to be a CFI for ATP, did you go in planning to drop out just before CFI school and take the balance of the money? I seem to recall you mentioning in another post that you were told not to show up for CFI school...but from what you posted up above, it appears that you did or did not have a problem with this?
Specifically, in what ways did they do this? I ask because potential ATP students might like to know what to look for.
[/quote]
You know, you might be right.
But if the "paying customer" treated me like I owed them something beyond the services we agreed to render in a written contract, and was less than professional in dealing with me about resolving their issues, I would have no qualms about telling them to do business elsewhere.
Look - I'm not saying you did this at all, but I've been reading your posts with interest, and they show a lot of signs of righteous indignation - you keep saying you were treated badly, but not specifically how or why you perceived this as bad treatment.
People have a hard time responding to generalities, and I can tell you with certainty that any business would as well. So, help us to understand, please.
Thanks, in advance.
Yes, I am bitter because i was taken advantage of by atp.
Next i was going to be a cfi back in a different state and build my hours there. Next do you know a any flight school that only charges 2k for all your cfi's? I haven't found one either.
I have been vegue on many things because instructors do look at this web page all the time and jk more or likely will respond negatively.
If you look into more of my past posts you will find the examples, but i am fearing any repricutions of telling who i am before i pass my checkrides. Give me a week and you will have all the examples you can handle.
Next i was going to be a cfi back in a different state and build my hours there. Next do you know a any flight school that only charges 2k for all your cfi's? I haven't found one either.
I have been vegue on many things because instructors do look at this web page all the time and jk more or likely will respond negatively.
If you look into more of my past posts you will find the examples, but i am fearing any repricutions of telling who i am before i pass my checkrides. Give me a week and you will have all the examples you can handle.
v1valarob
Well-Known Member
Something doesnt jive here.
You say you have 2 checkrides left, you also said you where literally on your way to CFI school when Jim K called you up and said "nope."
After your CMEL, which must be done before CFI school. You have:
CSEL, MEI, Single CFI, II.
However if you got booted from going to CFI school then you wouldnt have any of those instructor check rides. Which leaves only 1 checkride. So which 2 check rides do you have this up coming week?!?!
-Rob
v1valarob
Well-Known Member
What you said:
So you still have to do your CMEL and CSEL. Which means you could not have gone to CFI school because you have NO COMMERCIAL LICENSE!
-Rob
Wow! Rob you think this is a debate. One which you think you know, but obviously you are just an employee of atp trying to recruit. I was stating the facts. And yes, you have proved yourself ignorant.
I was told to get my cmel training in one day and take my checkride the same day at a different location. Then I was told not to go to cfi school. So that gave me a couple days to change my checkrides. And many people are forced to go to the cfi class and get their cmel while trying to train for their cfi.
Get your facts straight. And be honest with the position you hold in the company.
I was told to get my cmel training in one day and take my checkride the same day at a different location. Then I was told not to go to cfi school. So that gave me a couple days to change my checkrides. And many people are forced to go to the cfi class and get their cmel while trying to train for their cfi.
Get your facts straight. And be honest with the position you hold in the company.
v1valarob
Well-Known Member
Your right. I work for ATP and I have just gone into our system and blacklisted you from the industry. You might as well give up flying now.
This is becoming a joke.
-Rob