Spirit Airlines cancels all flights as pilots go on strike

Re: Spirit Airlines cancels all flights as pilots go on stri

Can someone help me understand the crux of the issue at Spirit?

I read this article in the paper yesterday:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/canadianpress/article/ALeqM5hM-ORVSZP-uyPkCWwNm4HzuGWVGA

...

Spirit said Sunday it offered to raise pilot pay by about 29 per cent over five years — a move that would have cost the company an additional $70 million. Work rule changes would mean pilots would have to fly more to earn that money, however. Spirit's offer also kept a four-day break between every pilot trip, something the company said no other ALPA contract has. The offer also included a $3,000 signing bonus and a larger retirement plan match.

"It is surprising to me that ALPA would turn down this generous offer that would have paid senior captains over $200,000 per year," said Spirit Airlines President and CEO Ben Baldanza in a statement. "I am concerned that our employees are being used in a broader political game that may not be in the interest of their careers or their families. This deal should be about Spirit and Spirit only, not about the pilots whose contracts are under negotiation at other ALPA carriers."

But Capt. Sean Creed, chairman of the Air Lines Pilot Association group at Spirit, said Sunday that the company's offer only matches inflation. He said that he's looking to have wages for Spirit pilots competitive with those at rivals like JetBlue Airways Corp.

Creed noted that a captain with 10 years' experience at JetBlue earns about $158 an hour; that compares with $138 an hour for a Spirit captain with 15 years' experience.
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In particular, I thought it was odd that Capt Creed didn't cite an example that used an even comparisons based on tenure. Any time I see that, red flags go up in my mind as I recall a lecture I once attended called "How to Lie with Statistics."

Using the pay scale link in the OP's note, I found the following pay rates for an A319/320 Capt with 10 yrs:

$125 - Spirit
$155 - Jet Blue

When I searched the list for other A319/320 operators, I found these three:

$133 - US Air
$135 - NWA
$156 - Delta

Using my rusty college stats skills, that puts median pay at $135 and average pay at $141.

What pay are Spirit pilots seeking for a 10 yr A319 Capt? I understand from what I've read that work rules and retirement are also part of the discussions, what are the issues there?

If anyone can help educate me, I'd really appreciate it.

Thanks
 
Re: Spirit Airlines cancels all flights as pilots go on stri

My understanding was that while mgmnt offered a higher hourly pay, they reduced the amount of extra time the pilots could work. So now the pilots would be making more money per hour, but would hardly ever exceed guarantee. The old bait and switch move I guess.
 
Re: Spirit Airlines cancels all flights as pilots go on stri

Okay, I just found this in another thread. This answers many of my questions.

Pilotdude3407 said:
Another one from the forum:

Some of the companies proposals:
- Longevity - 1 year will be earned with every 850 hours flown retroactive at contract signing. Basically will only get second year pay after flying 850 hours, 3rd year pay after 1700 hours flown.
- Retirement - reduce 8% match to 3%.
- Insurance - elimination of 2 PPO plans, and 1 EPO plan. Would go to High Deductible Health Plan with HRA funding mechanism.
- Elimination of 4 days off in a row clause.
- Company wants preferential bidding.
- Scheduling - FAR's
Click to expand...
 
Re: Spirit Airlines cancels all flights as pilots go on stri

There are many issues. The first and only offer for years called for $30 million in concessions. Then in late May the company alluded to a cost neutral contract. They did not come to the table until Friday and put forth the first offer at 3 AM which they then partially released to the press to show how greedy pilots rejected a 30% increase over 5 years that would have gotten them to $200,000 as a 15 year Captain flying 90 hours/month.

The problem is that in changing the way annual increases are awarded from years of seniority to Steps and basing the increase on flying 840 hours, everyone would take an immediate paycut. So, it became cost neutral. Take a cut now, and gradually get back up a bit higher than you are now.
 
Re: Spirit Airlines cancels all flights as pilots go on stri

The steps need to be taken off of the table and forever be banished from ever being mentioned again. It's simply a method to decrease everyone's pay and is not the way pay is figured in this industry.

What a scam. Don't you just love, "SPIRIT MATH?"

This comes from the same guy that proclaims that Spirit has the lowest amount of frequent flyer points, of any airline, needed for a frequent flyer ticket. (15,000).

The problem is that he only credits 1/2 a mile for every mile flown to a passengers frequent flyer account. So a passenger really has to fly 30,000 miles to get the FF ticket.

It's SPIRIT MATH!

Joe
 
Re: Spirit Airlines cancels all flights as pilots go on stri

Patrick said:
Well the public sees $125/hr and multiples that by 40 hours a week (or more) and says "wow, that's $5000 a week! See, pilots really do make $250k a year!" completely ignoring the fact that we don't get paid 40 hours per week (or anywhere even close).
Click to expand...

The "hourly" wage for pilots is a complete sham and it plays into management hands as far as PR goes... In reality you multiply the salary by 1000 and that's the very approximate amount you make in a year. So when you see first year FOs making 20 bucks an hour flying a jet, yup, they're making 20 grand a year.
 
Re: Spirit Airlines cancels all flights as pilots go on stri

And why, do you imagine, the media repeats the hourly numbers without context? I submit to you that it has nothing to do with donkeys or elephants, and everything to do with entrenched Interest, which is the Master of both the donkey and the elephant.

The current political process in the US resembles nothing so much as one of those basement electric car tracks for kids. One or the other might win, but the course is laid out ahead of time, and if you're in the car, your hand isn't on the trigger. You're a toy. Stop being a toy. Vote third party...if necessary, from the rooftops.
 
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