Southwest Advise

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Be careful about the aircraft not weighing more than 20,000lbs MTOW. I keep reading about airlines getting more and more strict about you getting your PIC turbine time in something that weighs less.

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At present, SWA does not impose a weight limit for the turbine PIC time. (If they did, would that disqualify a great many military fighter pilots? What are the weights in those planes anyway?)

I know a SWA captain who was hired with all 1,000 PIC turbine logged in a Caravan flying skydivers. Of course at the time they were hired they were flying the Jetstream for Eagle, (but not as a captain) and had logged all their PIC time prior to going into a 121 operation.

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lol

How much do you think these Fighters Weigh?

Here are some max takeoff weights for Military Fighters:

F-14 72,900 lbs
F-15 68,000 lbs
F-16 37,500 lbs
F/A-18 66,000 lbs
F/A-22 60,000 lbs
 
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If it were me, I'd rather be at ExpressJet flying a jet around the US, Canada, and Mexico than a turbo prop making short runs around the southwest but that's a personal preference and different for everyone. I feel that experience will open up more options down the road. It's difficult to be picky in this career. Also, how old are you? Slow down, enjoy what you are doing at the momment and don't be in such a hurry to get to the next step...it'll come when it comes. Trust me you'll be a lot happier if you approach this career that way. Above all else, good luck with both interviews. The good news is that either option is a potentially good one. I think XJT will impress you while you're in Houston. PM me if you have any questions and I'll atleast share my experiences as a XJT FO so far.

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I totally disagree with this thinking. BE PICKY! Do what you WANT. Don't settle. Don't "take your time". Do what you need to do NOW to get where you ultimately want to be. This doesn't mean you shouldn't enjoy the journey and value your experiences, of course you should! Get PIC turbine as soon as you can and don't worry about flying around the US in a "jet" just yet. Hey, if that's how the cookie crumbles, great, if not, great. If you have an opportunity at Scenic or Ameriflight, TAKE IT! You'll be in command of a kerosene burning machine a lot quicker and getting what I believe to be, "better experience" anyway, comparing it to the regional jet scenario. Whatever you do, if you want to make some real money and fly some larger equipment, DON'T slow down. Get moving and keep the ultimate goal in sight.
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I agree with JonnyB. My friend just got hired at Amflight and it's six months to turbine PIC. I told him in a year he could have more turbine PIC than I had when I got hired at UPS.
 
I partly agree with both of the posts above but I also think that hiring pool is a lot different these days than it was as little as 5-10 yrs ago. With the increasing number of regional jets out there the number of qualified applicants with 1000+ PIC in a regional jet is always increasing. I could be wrong but I think airlines like Southwest would prefer applicants with jet time over turboprop time all else equal. Not saying that Tprop experience is in any way inferior but the rj is a more representative of their fleet. Also I did not so much mean to say that he should slow down his career process as much as meant to say that he better damn well enjoy where he is because in all likelihood most of us are going to be here for at least a few years. Perhaps it didn't come across that way. In the end once you get to the interview character is as much or more important than anything else especially someplace like SWA.
 
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could be wrong but I think airlines like Southwest would prefer applicants with jet time over turboprop time all else equal. Not saying that Tprop experience is in any way inferior but the rj is a more representative of their fleet.

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Honest truth, I think SWA doesn't care where you got the time. They look more at the applicant than his logbook.
 
I used to live right next to VGT where Scenic flies out of. My concern would be these 5 things:

1. Mostly you take off out of 1 airport and mostly land at the same(unless you get a slot in there Beech 1900C)

2. Not much IFR. If you fly the ditch it is only on clear sunny days, plus how many IFR days have you seen in Vegas? I lived there 10 years, and can only remember a handful without thunderstorms.

3. Most of Scenics planes are fixed gear Twin Otters(although they are getting in retractables and have one Beech 1900C). Would it make a difference if the gear is fixed or not?

4. None of their aircraft have glass cockpits because they really dont need them, and I dont see them buying any aircraft with them anytime soon.

5. Scenic doesn't pay great and cost of living is shooting through the roof in Vegas(My parents bought a house for 150k back in 2001 just sold it in December for 285k with no remodling at all).

That said, I had an acquaintenace(spelled right?) hire on with Scenic and got upgraded 6 months later so youll get turbine PIC very quick.
 
I appreciate everyones responses. I am going to apply at both, and if I get hired at Scenic I can start builing that time. If after a few years, approximately 1000 Turbine PIC, I could always reapply for Express Jet as well as Southwest and just wait it out. I meet all the requirements for Express Jet now, why wouldn't my added experience at Scenic help? But I am getting a Southwest Mentor and who knows maybe it will be a check airman, or someone who can ease the transition. Thanks again to all.
 
We had guys in my newhire class who left scenic and another vegas sight-seeing type airline for XJET. Scenic would probably be fun for a while, but the way things in the industry are looking right now, I'd probably want to get on with a regional where I could tolerate spending 5-10 years.
 
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I'd probably want to get on with a regional where I could tolerate spending 5-10 years.

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While true, for me that's losing sight of my ultimate goal, which is not regional captain. Nothing says you can't get the PIC turbine from Scenic and THEN go to a regional until you qualify to apply at SWA.
 
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for me that's losing sight of my ultimate goal, which is not regional captain

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Exactly my point. Besides, how many times do I have to say.........Scenic isn't the only option. There are other 121 and 135 ops. that would fit into this category, plus many King Airs, Citations, Cheyennes etc. that need PIC's! Hello.......is this thing on?!
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It's interesting how some people who have gone to a regional airline almost try to convince themselves and OTHERS that sitting in the right seat of an RJ for 4-10 years is the best choice or the only smart choice. Couldn't be more untrue. There are MANY options, most of which are better than the above (IMEPO).
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I also find it interesting how many pilots detour from there well though out and strategic plans to reach there ultimate goal(s), by the opportunity to fly an RJ NOW.
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It's interesting how some people who have gone to a regional airline almost try to convince themselves and OTHERS that sitting in the right seat of an RJ for 4-10 years is the best choice or the only smart choice.

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Don't need to convince anyone. He asked to compare Scenic and Expressjet and that's what I tried to do. Sure flying an RJ isn't the only choice, but it's not a bad one. The work rules are decent at most operators and the pay isn't terrible after first year probation. Obviously the advantages to Scenic are faster upgrade if you're willing to stick around that long and being in the same place every night. Plus, if company pilots are interviewing you at southwest or whatever major you go to, flying something other than an RJ will probably get you brownie points (rj's aren't all that popular with most mainline pilots, although southwest might not care).

I say 4-10 years only because I reccomend to hope for the best but prepare for the worst. What if southwest stops hiring and there's nowhere to go when it's time to bail on Scenic? January 04 newhires at Expressjet are projected to upgrade this fall-winter, so it's not thaaaat bad.
 
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I say 4-10 years only because I reccomend to hope for the best but prepare for the worst. What if southwest stops hiring and there's nowhere to go when it's time to bail on Scenic? January 04 newhires at Expressjet are projected to upgrade this fall-winter, so it's not thaaaat bad.

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That is great, but only because of all the growth.

What about the new hires from this past fall early winter, I bet the projected upgrade is much much longer. Having said that, I wish I had the hours to apply there right now. You guy/gals are lucky.
 
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What about the new hires from this past fall early winter

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Don't know. I've been online for a month (had the seniority number for 3 months) and I've got 80 people below me on the IAH FO list (525/604). If things continue at about half this rate, about 2.5 yrs to upgrade. Too early to tell though.
 
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What if southwest stops hiring and there's nowhere to go when it's time to bail on Scenic?

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I know the aviation world is pretty unpredictable, but SWA would have to been in some SERIOUS trouble to stop hiring....for any positions. I got hired as a ramper there in April of 2002. Most rampers from the majors were getting cut or furloughed then. SWA also has a steady flow of Captains retiring (a lot of them way before they're 60), so there's normally a lot of FOs upgrading. If SWA isn't hiring "when it's time to bail on Scenic." then staying at Scenic would probably be the best bet since the odds are the industry has turned so bad no one is hiring.
 
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What if southwest stops hiring and there's nowhere to go when it's time to bail on Scenic?

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I know the aviation world is pretty unpredictable, but SWA would have to been in some SERIOUS trouble to stop hiring....for any positions. I got hired as a ramper there in April of 2002. Most rampers from the majors were getting cut or furloughed then. SWA also has a steady flow of Captains retiring (a lot of them way before they're 60), so there's normally a lot of FOs upgrading. If SWA isn't hiring "when it's time to bail on Scenic." then staying at Scenic would probably be the best bet since the odds are the industry has turned so bad no one is hiring.

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Anyone know the payrate for Scenic new hires? What about Captain pay?
 
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