"Sometimes you Get Wet"

[Tiger815]

I don't want to see you driving on the highway ever again if you go by the "no ferry" policy. If you are involved in an accident, shut down the highway, cause officers to have to spend duty time in rerouting traffic, force business people to be late for meetings, cause firemen to come extract you from the car, cause the ambulance EMT and driver to miss lunch, make the tow truck driver go 20 miles out of his way, make your spouse take off work early...

Get my drift?

No, really I don't. I never said a thing about "No Ferry". I said if your ferry operation results in a rescue in the middle of the ocean that you should be responsible for the costs that rescue incurs.

To use your example, my insurance will usually be charged for that ambulance ride and I certainly will get billed by the tow truck driver. I'd also likely be held responsible for any environmental clean up if that were a factor.

As to the use of public safety resources (police, fire, etc), I already pay for that through my taxes. Yes, ok my taxes pay for the CG also. So I'll stipulate that if you require rescue in US waters you're covered for CG activites, but should still be on the hook to reimburse any commecial vessel thats required to pull your fat out of the fire. If you ditch in the middle of the Pacific and CG have to come get you, you should get the bill for the CG also.

It's called taking responsiblity for your decisions.

Get my drift?

 

[TFaudree_ERAU]

As to the use of public safety resources (police, fire, etc), I already pay for that through my taxes. Yes, ok my taxes pay for the CG also. So I'll stipulate that if you require rescue in US waters you're covered for CG activites, but should still be on the hook to reimburse any commecial vessel thats required to pull your fat out of the fire. If you ditch in the middle of the Pacific and CG have to come get you, you should get the bill for the CG also.

There, you said it. Just like others have already said. Coast Guard services are part of your taxes. Why do you say once that "you're covered for CG activities", but then in the next sentence you say "you should get the bill for the CG also"? Are you putting a range limit on the "free" CG services? And the ship driver could have simply said "NO!". Why should the downed ferry pilot have to pay for the captain's generosity?

 

[Tiger815]

There, you said it. Just like others have already said. Coast Guard services are part of your taxes. Why do you say once that "you're covered for CG activities", but then in the next sentence you say "you should get the bill for the CG also"? Are you putting a range limit on the "free" CG services? And the ship driver could have simply said "NO!". Why should the downed ferry pilot have to pay for the captain's generosity?

A ship captain is OBLIGATED by maritime law to render assistance in the event of an SOS to the extent such assitance would not jepordize his ship and crew. Generosity has nothing to do with it, and to have said no would have resulted in serious action against the captain and his employer. So I put the same question to you -- Why should the shipping company (and US taxpayers) pay because someone made an economic decsion that it was cheap/easier to fly a small plane over a vast ocean?

Was I placing limits on the free CG services? Yes. To the limit of US territorial waters.

 

[Tiger815]

Does anyone really believe that if we made ferry flights across the ocean illegal, and made it illegal for yuppies to go mountain climbing, that our taxes would be reduced?...or that our tax money would be used for a "better purpose?

I re-reviewed the thread and don't see where anyone has argued for making ferry flights illegal. The original post questioned the use of the resources and my argument is "Lost yuppies should pay for their rescue" as should pilots that find themselves in the middle of the ocean (beyond US juristiction).

Both the yuppie and the pilot made the decsions that put them in harms way. If YOU evaluate the risk/reward and decide YOU are willing to accept it, why is it then that SOCIETY at large is expected to bear the expense of saving your a$$ when its revealed your risk analysis was incorrect?

I was into mountaineering when I was younger and am getting into sailing now. I have always despised the mentality that "someone will save me" from my own stupidity/incompetence/plain bad luck, and I shouldn't bear any financial burden for that service. Seriously, if I have a "right" to be rescued shouldn't my surviors be able to sue if the rescue was not timely enough to save me? Where does the line get drawn?

When I was climbing I was always prepared for self-rescue and had to do so on more than one occasion. I have "rescue insurance" in the form of a prepaid towing contract should I screw up on my boat even though I'll likely never be outside US waters and my taxes pay for the CG.

IMHO, mountaineers, sailors and pilots should weigh the risks and be prepared to pay the consequences, financial and otherwise when they undertake extraordinary risks such as flying/sailing across the ocean or taking on a mountain where other lives would be at risk to save you.

None of this detracts from the valor or importance of the USCG. Saving lives is part of their mission and they do a good job of it.

 

[Louie1975]

First of all, why would the ferry pilot have to pay for the rescue? Shouldn't the person who decided to have the plane ferried pay? If a typical ferry pilot decides 'its too much risk', then the purchaser of the airplane gets another ferry pilot.

Also, I believe I read somewhere that if the airplane is taken apart, in addition to having it put back together, the plane must be recertified as well. I can see why someone might not want their brand new twin taken apart and then put back together. The question that might then strike an oversees buyer is 'who then would be qualified to put this airplane back together.'

I may be a little biased because I think after I get some experience I would like to do transatlantic ferry. Talked to some guy on 'that other website' and he sent me pics of a ferry trip that he did in a twin from the US to China. The trip was made with 2 other twins and he showed me pics of all the places he stopped in Europe and Middle East. I was like WOW!!! I could see doing this! I love flying, history, culture, etc. Would seem like the perfect job.

 

[Louie1975]

Oh yea, I think I would take some form of very advanced egress training!

 

[Tiger815]

First of all, why would the ferry pilot have to pay for the rescue? Shouldn't the person who decided to have the plane ferried pay? If a typical ferry pilot decides 'its too much risk', then the purchaser of the airplane gets another ferry pilot.

Ok, now you're taking me to literally.

I really think the insurance carrier should pay, but don't really care if the pilot (or his employer) pay for the coverage and pass it on to the aircraft owner as part of the cost of the flight service provided or if the owner is required to purchase the coverage directly. Either way, the cost would ultimately go to the AC owner.