Something to watch for CJC pilots...
- Thread starter Airdale
- Start date
Cruise
Well-Known Member
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
That was my thought, too. I've heard of the Teamsters threatening management and scabs, but not their own membership. That's more or less suicide right there. If your own union is threatening it's members, it's long overdue to be tossed.
Airdale
Well-Known Member
Not personally, but another pilot who started a poll on the website about our satisfaction with the IBT. The results were overwhelming, nearly 90% who voted said they want IBT out. Unfortunately we don't even have half of our pilot group participate in the website. Needless to say, the guy who started the poll was threatened by the Union leadership about creating a stir.
I wouldn't tolerate that kind of move by the Union, and certainly in my opinion it proves how ridiculous the Teamsters union is and that just adds fuel to the cause to get rid of them. We have a large group spread across 3 certificates and a lot of bases and equipment. Reaching out to them will be difficult and no easy task. I think it would be in ALPA's interest to get us on board as well, being one of the largest pilot groups in the Regional sector. I want to be heavily involved with our union, but I refuse to participate in the IBT. Unless I see truck drivers coming out to support us, they need to go. The lack of communication from the union, the lack of help to reduce furloughs, the lack of communication to the furloughees, the lack of job protection (BUF case) and a weak hand in front of the company are all good reasons to make a change here.
The bottom half of the pilot group seems pretty annoyed and pretty gung-ho about changing our representation. After all, some of us may be here for a long time and we want to have solid representation with our company. Many of us feel IBT doesn't do that and want them gone. The resistance is coming from more senior pilots who probably don't have much of an interest in the work involved and the increase in dues to bring on ALPA, who in their eyes, is the devil of all unions. To get ALPA in here, we're going to need to break out every big gun we have thanks to the Airways East pilots and their boneheaded move. They've convinced many of our senior pilots that ALPA is the devil.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
Don't for one second think I DON'T think you guess should be ALPA, but...
Was he actually threatened or just told that he couldn't use a Union website to try to oust the Union? The ALPA by laws are pretty clear about prohibiting the use of ALPA funded mediums to promote anti ALPA stuff.
You would still end up costing ALPA more money then you generate. Your pay scales (as is the case with all the regionals) are no where near high enough for your dues money to offset the costs your group would bring. Thankfully, up until now, ALPA hasn't used that as a measuring stick as to what groups to accept.
Ironically, if it wasn't for ALPA those senior pilots wouldn't have gotten the 170s in the first place.
Again, don't think I am saying you guys shouldn't try as hard as you can get get ALPA on board. I'm not at all.
Was he actually threatened or just told that he couldn't use a Union website to try to oust the Union? The ALPA by laws are pretty clear about prohibiting the use of ALPA funded mediums to promote anti ALPA stuff.
You would still end up costing ALPA more money then you generate. Your pay scales (as is the case with all the regionals) are no where near high enough for your dues money to offset the costs your group would bring. Thankfully, up until now, ALPA hasn't used that as a measuring stick as to what groups to accept.
To get ALPA in here, we're going to need to break out every big gun we have thanks to the Airways East pilots and their boneheaded move. They've convinced many of our senior pilots that ALPA is the devil.
Ironically, if it wasn't for ALPA those senior pilots wouldn't have gotten the 170s in the first place.
Again, don't think I am saying you guys shouldn't try as hard as you can get get ALPA on board. I'm not at all.
surreal1221
Well-Known Member
Say it isn't so!!
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
That's true, but it's rarely enforced. ALPA allows lots of anti-ALPA stuff on the national web boards. I always argued that Dan Ford and the rest of his RJDC cronies should have been banned permanently from the web boards because of the anti-ALPA tripe that they constantly posted, but ALPA kept letting it go. They're quite lenient.
I'm not so sure about that anymore. I've been running some numbers, and I think they might actually just barely break even, assuming they don't actually have to go on strike. They have enough senior guys on the larger EMBs that they bring the average compensation up quite a bit. If they don't break even, then it would be very close. Within $100k per year, I would say. And the long-term benefits of having one of the biggest regionals under the umbrella would be well worth any costs.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
I certainly agree that having them under the ALPA banner would be a huge benefit to the industry. They are already on board the FFD task force which has already proven to be helpful. However, I don't think nearly enough of their guys are making 100K (the latest figure I saw was that >50% of a pilot group must make more than that to fund the group) to cover their costs. Also because they have such a huge base structure there would be a larger than normal LEC budget. But, in the end that really isn't anywhere near as important as the other stuff.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
I actually hadn't considered that. That changes the calculations somewhat. I'm used to a 2-4 domicile operation. Each domicile adds costs, especially if you have a separate LEC for each one. How many domiciles does RAH have?
Really? That actually surprises me. I figured you guys would be one of the few B-carriers that paid your own way.
Airdale
Well-Known Member
Threatened as in, say goodbye to your job and possibly career. Lets put it this way, enough of a threat to back him into a corner and basically disappear for awhile. Ridiculous.
A lot of us want ALPA, but remember ALPA thumbed their nose at CHQ years ago when the CHQ pilots wanted ALPA. A lot of the CHQ guys remember that and for that reason don't want anything to do with ALPA. ALPA is basically the reason we are represented by Teamsters. If ALPA actually wanted to represent us, they could have easily.
I can understand why ALPA would look the other way at a small CHQ pilot group, but not this time. We are 2000+ strong and many predict will grow even more over the next 5-10yrs. The mountains to climb to make this happen are huge, and unfortunately I can't climb it on Sept. 8th because of the furlough. But, I will do whatever I can to get it rolling and pass it on to the group of pilots that are serious about the revolution. I hope ALPA is welcoming, otherwise we might end up with some sort of in house Republic Pilots Union.
BTW Todd, I got your message. I'm out of the country, so I'll call you when I get back tomorrow.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
This pilot should contact the Department of Labor and file a complaint. And if anything actually happens to him, then I have an attorney I can put him in touch with to sue the pants off the IBT for a massive DFR violation.
BTW Todd, I got your message. I'm out of the country, so I'll call you when I get back tomorrow.
No problem.
Firebird2XC
Well-Known Member
Not personally, but another pilot who started a poll on the website about our satisfaction with the IBT. The results were participate in the IBT. Unless I see truck drivers coming out to support us, they need to go. The lack of communication from the union, the lack of help to reduce furloughs, the lack of communication to the furloughees, the lack of job protection (BUF case) and a weak hand in front of the company are all good reasons to make a change here.
....
The bottom half of the pilot group seems pretty annoyed and pretty gung-ho about changing our representation. After all, some of us may be here for a long time and we want to have solid representation with our
....
we're going to need to break out every big gun we have thanks to the Airways East pilots and their boneheaded move. They've convinced many of our senior pilots that ALPA is the devil.
Yep, I was right. That's some serious guano. Since your senior guys are taking notes from Airways guys, follow suit.
Decertify your union. Then you can get a union that doesn't threaten its own membership.
That's just crap. Seriously.
