Some thoughts

BajtheJino said:
Losing a loved one is sad, I know, but how long are people going to milk this before we move on? Life does continue.






WTF?



I gotta say I think the last five or six post on this subject have pretty much covered everything. We can all quaterback, I have, but covering this over and over and over solves nothing.Let the flame begin.
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No flame here dude, sorry. I will say that if you are tired of the discussion, please stop reading!

This was the first time I read anything from Turbine on this subject and his ideas were well thought out and respectful. Unlike some who go from thread to thread spouting the same thing over and over, not actually trying to read and gain wisdom from the group, or empathize with how others may be feeling, just pushing their ideas over and over . . .
I would hate to have a thoughtful person stop posting:)
 
Well said jtrain609,

single pilot freight is not easy.

single pilot IFR can be tough.

I agree navajo's do not have the automation the RJ's or larger aircraft have,
making workload higher.

The engines can be finicky eh..?
 
Bumblebee said:
No flame here dude, sorry. I will say that if you are tired of the discussion, please stop reading!

This was the first time I read anything from Turbine on this subject and his ideas were well thought out and respectful. Unlike some who go from thread to thread spouting the same thing over and over, not actually trying to read and gain wisdom from the group, or empathize with how others may be feeling, just pushing their ideas over and over . . .
I would hate to have a thoughtful person stop posting:)
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Thanks Bumblebee,

appreciate it
 
jtrain609 said:
the guys that came through when I was there seemed to either be horrible pilots (way more than I thought possible), or guys that had a hard on to fly freight.
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This isn't an insult at all, but that made me laugh extremely hard. I guess the general consensus is that either they went to AMF as a last resort because no one else would hire them or they went there because it was their sole passion in life (and these were guy other 50% that excelled.
 
I can backup jtrain 100% on this. If you haven't seen it firsthand and lived it day to day it is easy to disbelieve.

When you fly single pilot freight you are all you've got. No more setting the CDI 10 degrees off, no more misinterpreting where you are in relation to the VOR. Some of the most basic of IFR knowledge - what SHOULD be the foundation of an IFR rating - is routinely glossed over by CFIIs so long as students can track a needle and follow an ILS.

I used to brush off the idea of Lance Captain or Cheiftain Captain - those planes don't have captains they simply have pilots right? Now, 2000 flight hours later and as an airline captain, I realize there wasn't so much a difference after all. Now imagine going straight from CFIIing (watching somebody else fly) to a demanding captain position and you begin to understand why the washout rate can be high.
 
E_Dawg said:
I can backup jtrain 100% on this. If you haven't seen it firsthand and lived it day to day it is easy to disbelieve.

When you fly single pilot freight you are all you've got. No more setting the CDI 10 degrees off, no more misinterpreting where you are in relation to the VOR. Some of the most basic of IFR knowledge - what SHOULD be the foundation of an IFR rating - is routinely glossed over by CFIIs so long as students can track a needle and follow an ILS.

I used to brush off the idea of Lance Captain or Cheiftain Captain - those planes don't have captains they simply have pilots right? Now, 2000 flight hours later and as an airline captain, I realize there wasn't so much a difference after all. Now imagine going straight from CFIIing (watching somebody else fly) to a demanding captain position and you begin to understand why the washout rate can be high.
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I know I'm way off topic (to the OP sorry about that), but why would you set your CDI 10 degrees off in the first place?
 
It was just an example. As for why: rushing and distraction are the main reasons. It does happen, but it's NOT something you want to mess up, since it's rarely double checked after it's set, and entire approaches are shot based on its' validity.
 
E_Dawg said:
It was just an example. As for why: rushing and distraction are the main reasons. It does happen, but it's NOT something you want to mess up, since it's rarely double checked after it's set, and entire approaches are shot based on its' validity.
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Got ya, so not intentionally set 10 degrees off. Yeah, and I can see what you mean. Once it's set, you typically don't check it again, which could mean bad news if it's off.
 
Bumblebee said:
No flame here dude, sorry. I will say that if you are tired of the discussion, please stop reading!
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The problem is its not a discussion its starting to turn into a circle jerk. Its like the threads that people post of crashes and everyone rushes to post the obligatory "RIP"-dont want to be left out! How many times can people say "I think they crashed because of " ", we as pilots are awesome, we need more money, we need more rest...."
We are not special, we chose our jobs, we knew the pay and sometimes people die. People get killed in every job field. Its time most people grow up and accept their lot in life. If we post the same thing over and over this website becomes irrelevant.

Side note: S.P.IFR is not that tough. Its a mind game. If you make it a big deal it can quickly become one.
 
E Dawg,

I agree on everything you've said. If you ask most airline pilots that are used to crew operations, they would most likely tell you they wouldn't fly single pilot IFR.

Bajthejino,

It seems like it's just a job to you, and you just want to go to work and get it over with. I may be wrong, majority of pilots are very passionate. But if you don't like it that much,quit, there are plenty of people that would be more then happy to fill in.

Again this is way off the OP.
 
BajtheJino said:
The problem is its not a discussion its starting to turn into a circle jerk. Its like the threads that people post of crashes and everyone rushes to post the obligatory "RIP"-dont want to be left out! How many times can people say "I think they crashed because of " ", we as pilots are awesome, we need more money, we need more rest...."
We are not special, we chose our jobs, we knew the pay and sometimes people die. People get killed in every job field. Its time most people grow up and accept their lot in life. If we post the same thing over and over this website becomes irrelevant.

Side note: S.P.IFR is not that tough. Its a mind game. If you make it a big deal it can quickly become one.
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Here's the deal, this website has answered the same questions for every new person every time. We try to use patience and empathy while we remember that it may be their only experience so far. It's the same as the passenger on your sixth leg of the day, this is your sixth flight, but it may be their first, so we must remember when we are responding to people here that, although we have been immersed in the discussion for days, they have only started the process and deserve the same patience that I or you have recieved when we were new.

If I don't have the patience, when I burn out on a subject, I stop reading before I give impatient answers and let others have a natural discussion without trying to slam the door shut by saying all right already I've had enough. If you have had enough then stay out of the room, if you want to continue reading then show the patience and respect that we all deserve.

mattp1803 said:
I know I'm way off topic (to the OP sorry about that), but why would you set your CDI 10 degrees off in the first place?
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turn right heading 010 and you turn it to 100 . . . although I've never done that!;)
 
How about the Amflight guys that were dog tired, coming back from a training flight up in Montana. They were doing a VOR approach where the VOR was the FAF, and there was a dog leg to the airport. All they had to do was spin the HSI 30 degree's to the right.

They didn't, and hit a mountain.
 
jtrain609 said:
How about the Amflight guys that were dog tired, coming back from a training flight up in Montana. They were doing a VOR approach where the VOR was the FAF, and there was a dog leg to the airport. All they had to do was spin the HSI 30 degree's to the right.

They didn't, and hit a mountain.
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A simple thing that anyone could do. That's what makes flying fun it's like a video game just a series of simple tasks. That's also probably why I don't get much satisfaction out of the work.
 
Killtron2000 said:
A simple thing that anyone could do. That's what makes flying fun it's like a video game just a series of simple tasks. That's also probably why I don't get much satisfaction out of the work.
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It's just like a video game?

Son I don't think you realize the gravity of your chosen profession.
 
jtrain609 said:
It's just like a video game?

Son I don't think you realize the gravity of your chosen profession.
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There is more to the profession than that but actually flying a plane feels like one. I don't worry about anything I do in flight sim of course but when I actually shoot an approach or something the closest thing I can relate it to is a game. You can keep score with altitude and heading and the CDI and you definetley have boundaries and actually intercepting needles and altitudes feels like some kind of video game to me.
 
Killtron2000 said:
Out of the 100 or so students I saw come and go from the school I did my ratings at only 2 never got to solo because they we're awful.
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Those people were already interested in flying. Ask the average Joe if they would wanna learn. You'd get a firm no. It takes a special set of balls/ovaries to be a pilot.
 
Amin said:
Those people were already interested in flying. Ask the average Joe if they would wanna learn. You'd get a firm no. It takes a special set of balls/ovaries to be a pilot.
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They might not want to do it but it doesn't mean they're incapable. I wouldn't want to be a boxer but that doesn't mean Mike Tyson deserves my respect.
 
Wow, so many different things...

I agree with what Baj was (I think) saying (and you can correct me if I'm wrong), that we're not gods because we fly airplanes, nor are the issues we deal with unique to flying. Other professions are equally demanding. And we shouldn't walk around with a chip on our shoulder whining about dignity, when *we* are the ones who determine whether we're truly professionals or not (and I'm talking about behavior here, not pay/schedules and all that).

I agree that *most* people can be taught to control an airplane. But I'll also agree with jtrain that some people just shouldn't be in command of an airplane. Being a pilot is more than manipulating controls. It's not that the skills, mentality and aptitudes required to be a pilot are superhuman or rare, it's just that they're not universal. Some people shouldn't be doctors, public speakers, truck drivers, or operate power tools. Some people shouldn't be pilots.

Just my thoughts... :)
 
High_Alpha said:
I agree that *most* people can be taught to control an airplane. But I'll also agree with jtrain that some people just shouldn't be in command of an airplane. Being a pilot is more than manipulating controls. It's not that the skills, mentality and aptitudes required to be a pilot are superhuman or rare, it's just that they're not universal. Some people shouldn't be doctors, public speakers, truck drivers, or operate power tools. Some people shouldn't be pilots.

Just my thoughts... :)
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By the same token, other's shouldn't be flying single pilot. There are pilots that need the crew environment and team out of necessity.
 
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