Skywest doing the branded thing?

[little_cricket]

I don't want ALPA at SkyWest (for now) because I don't believe we need them now.

This is not the time.

Just curious when it might be "the time"?

After all, you did recognized the losses of QOL from the previous post... You do know that there can't be another vote for two years after this one. And, why would another union try again, wasting their resources? But alas, by the time you recognize the need for one, there will be more new hires like you just happy to be there... And, the cycle continues.

Oh well, I feel they have you snowed. But, it is your decision and I respect that, even if I think your wrong. Good luck and I hope you never need a union...

 

[little_cricket]

Oh yeah, couple more things I want to add to the list...

No merger protection

No say in seniority integration

A few examples:

Increase health care costs

Loss of cancellation pay

Reserve Bucket System

PBS

Ready reserve

Loss annual bonus, replaced by inferior performance rewards

No COL increases

No change in Vacation/User accrual rates in 15 years

On again, off again, on again new hire pay

Double bunking in training


All these changes with little or no input from SAPA!!! And, these are the ones off the top of my head.... I am sure that the list can be added to.

If the choice is between having SAPA and nothing, I would choose nothing. Because, at least then the problems would be directly address instead of told to talk you SAPA rep (and nothing happens) or fill out a PIC (and nothing happens). It is time to end the masquerade!!!

 

[Hootie]

It was perfectly normal.

Everyone here is fighting like teenage school girls. Grow up.

If you don't like what's KNOWN before applying/accepting a job, don't take the job.

Plus, I'm trying to let people know there are other jobs out there that don't treat you like crap.

Good luck in your fight but it's a going to be never ending battle that will only screw each other. There are too many pilots from different backgrounds so getting everyone to agree on something is impossible.

So again...what do you do?

 

[Cruise]

So again...what do you do?

If I remember correctly (from back in the day) he's doing something with Cirrus. Such as ferrying new planes and instructing new owners.....but that's just vague recollection. Don't know if that's right.



I'll let the man, himself explain what he does/ who he works for.

WELL StuckinGFK? Wadda U doin'?

 

[stuckingfk]

If I remember correctly (from back in the day) he's doing something with Cirrus. Such as ferrying new planes and instructing new owners.....but that's just vague recollection. Don't know if that's right.



I'll let the man, himself explain what he does/ who he works for.

WELL StuckinGFK? Wadda U doin'?

Currently, flying a Lear 45 in Houston TX in a large flight department. Straight 91, no charter.

Start my new job in the upper Midwest middle of October with the above specifications. I drafted a contract and was approved and signed by both of us. I was lowballed twice on pay which was met by two rejections. Third and final offer sealed the deal with 33% more than the original offer.

I was definitely in a good position because of my PIC type, currency, and recency of experience (400 hours in 9 months, which is a lot in the corporate world). Also get to fly left seat when it's my legs.

I'm sure someone will ask this, I have 1700 hours. Got my first jet job at 800 hours in October of 2005 and been flying them ever since.

 

[Cav]

Same way someone can be pro-choice and choose not to have an abortion.

Nope not the same, sorry.

 

[meritflyer]

I don't think it will happen any time soon. Specially from what I hear about expressjet losing money on theirs.

Branded ops have been in effect for 6 months. Would you really expect it to make cash from the get go?

Here is XJT's report for branded load factors, released today -

During the month, ExpressJet branded RPMs totaled 190 million on 298 million ASMs, resulting in an August load factor of 63.8%. The company flew 16,870 block hours and operated 8,790 departures during the month. The average stage length in the branded operation was 679 miles.

A 64% load factor is impressive for a new operation plus, its still in the refining process with routes and coverage.

 

[jtrain609]

I saw that the other day, and I can't believe branded loads are that high already. I'm not sure FlyI ever hit those kind of load factors across the board.

 

[meritflyer]

I saw that the other day, and I can't believe branded loads are that high already. I'm not sure FlyI ever hit those kind of load factors across the board.

Actually, they were at first. FlyI looked very promising with high loads.

Costs killed them though.

Remember, this is a marathon not a sprint.

 

[bike21]

Looks like the thread is winding down, but since I was in sim all day yesterday I thought I would share a few more thoughts

Its pretty damn good as it is. I don't think we need to mess with that.

No worries, a lot of us have this same feeling as a new hire. I will ask you how you feel next year sometime.

I just don't see much generosity comming through on the management side.

Can you show me an example of recent generosity?

As for pilot protection, just out of curiosity, does anyone here actually know first hand, a person who was fired from SkyWest for anything other than training failures, drugs/alcohol, or sexual harassement? On that note, does anyone know any union pilot who got to keep his job after one of the things above? And of course, the obvious solution would be not to land on the taxiway to begin with, but that's beside the point.

Lots of people have kept their jobs, lots of people have lost their jobs. Some paid thousands of dollars to get said jobs back, other paid nothing other than a mere 2% per paycheck.

You guys have this all wrong. Once we get a true Open Skies agreement, Jerry and Co. invade Canada 1812 style with their own equipment and give WestAir a run for their money. The wife and I move to Calgary, get *free* healthcare, and camp at Banff National Park on my days off.

Hmmm...Canada heh?

A union DOES NOT have to put a wall between managment and the pilots, it is simply A WAY OF COMMUNICATING.

Wise words.

And that's what I don't understand. You're getting hosed on your pay rates, but you say, "Well, it's ok!!!!

Not all of us

As long as SkyWest keeps its pay rates going in the right direction (they are pretty good now even!) and work rules they have (they also are good) who gives a flying monkey poo if they are union or not?

You know, I would be content staying non-union in a perfect world but is far from that.

On a side note, I read somewhere that the 2% override on the larger aircraft was actually a pay cut, because the legs are historically blocked something like 5% less. LOL!

True. That is why our genius (sinister?) bean counters and management came up with the BHO...errr BOHICA....to ensure we didn't actually receive a pay raise. 100% hose job. I still can't believe people actually voted yes on this. It's appalling.

good lord, with all this talk about skywest not paying well, I am cancelling my class date.... Off to Gulfstream I go!!!

LOL! Rumot has it the big wigs are in talks to offer more incentives for new hires. Seems we can be slightly re-active around these parts sometimes.

If the vote is held anytime soon, you won't have a vote being there less than a year, right?

I believe the cut off date is May 15, 2007 hire date.

Good points (except what's wrong with PBS?). But compare all of that to what Mesa puts up with. I rest my case.

Comparing ourselves to the one of the biggest screwjobs in airline history is not solid logic.

Oh for frack's sake people.

More wise words

 

[Seggy]

Same way someone can be pro-choice and choose not to have an abortion.

That's it. I'm not reading this thread anymore. If anyone has any more questions for me, send a PM.

So you run and hide because people disagree with you, post facts that don't support your point of view, and show you why ALPA representation is so important and that you have been drinking the company Kool-Aid?

REAL mature.

 

[Seggy]

So why should I pay 2% of my salary to get a union to spend 4 years negotiating a contract and by the time it goes into effect I'll have moved on?

You might be stuck there A LOT longer. The retirement age will be raised within two months to age 65.

Skywest upgrades WILL slowdown. 2% isn't that much for insurance.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

This thread is a perfect reminder of why so many pilots are starting to see the world the same way that Velocipede does. Union pilots are getting tired of non-union pilots riding our coattails and not contributing to the cause. In exchange they expect to get free jumpseat rides to work so they can continue to undermine and undercut us. It's starting to get really old. If this Skywest drive fails again, then I think you'll find lots of pilots that aren't exactly receptive of you anymore.

 

[meritflyer]

Skywest upgrades WILL slowdown. 2% isn't that much for insurance.

Or they could speed up. Majors are hiring like nut balls.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Or they could speed up. Majors are hiring like nut balls.

Yes, but Age-65 could change all of that at many of the majors.

 

[SD3Dog]

Oh for frack's sake people.

A few points.

Flyguy, unless you want to stay at Skywest your entire career, I wouldn't discount the value of union (not non-federally recognized 'employee associations'). I'll tell you that everywhere else you want to go down the road* has a legally NMB-binding contract negotiated by a union. Don't be the "Hey, weren't you the one that discounted union membership, but now you've got a grievance" guy.

Republic is growing into a monster. I'd be afraid that they may go into acquisition mode and personally I'd consider something a little stronger than an association to protect my interests during a potential M&A wildfire.

To everyone. If you're "Mesa-plus X", it does NOT mean you're getting a smoking deal. Yes, they've got problems because they're competing with everyone else cost-wise. I'll make everyone a gentleman's bet here, every regional and major airline will have it's swirl around the toilet bowl. The higher on the food chain you are of actually owning (and not simply bidding) for routes periodically, the better off you'll be.

I preach that daily, but lots of folks don't listen.

But I've found peace with that! Seriously.

Because people move from regional "A" to regional "B" does not mean that regional "B" is the shiznit. It simply means that there were a lot of people making lateral moves because the grass is always greener.

Really folks, it's not. Let's nip that in the bud off the bat.

People leave Delta for Air Tran, Air Tran to Delta. UPS to United, United to UPS... Southwest to American, American to Southwest. Some folks chase the "airline du jour". We'll all have our time in the sewer and we'll all have our time basking on the sunny hilltop of "The Airline to Work For(tm)".

Don't burn bridges. Make pals. NETWORK. COMMUNICATE. Folks on all three sides of the issue need to communicate rationally, not egotistically.

Look at the history of the business folks. It applies today like it did back in the Eastern, Braniff and TWA days.

* Edit: FDX, UPS, Air Tran, SWA, etc...

Sounds like good words of wisdom to me. :yeahthat:

 

[mrivc211]

You don't think a union would help you.

I do.

We can't find any common ground.

There's no point in arguing, so I'm not gonna continue to simply try to ram rod this down your throat. I've work at a non union shop, and now I'm working at a union carrier. I've seen the difference, and most of what you're saying is patently false. If you'd like to continue, we can do it through PM's but I'm not interested in mucking up Doug's forums.

This paragraph pretty much sums up how I feel with most new hires. Even guys that have been around our property for over a year. I just flew with a guy who grauated UCLA with an MBA. That was so much fun. Having him telling me how he's pro-business and anti-labor. Forget the fact that he doesnt realize what he's done is a conflict of interest, it just amazes me these morons are out there.

 

[mrivc211]

Branded ops have been in effect for 6 months. Would you really expect it to make cash from the get go?

Here is XJT's report for branded load factors, released today -

During the month, ExpressJet branded RPMs totaled 190 million on 298 million ASMs, resulting in an August load factor of 63.8%. The company flew 16,870 block hours and operated 8,790 departures during the month. The average stage length in the branded operation was 679 miles.

A 64% load factor is impressive for a new operation plus, its still in the refining process with routes and coverage.

That is pretty impressive. Not bad for only 6 months.

 

[mrivc211]

You might be stuck there A LOT longer. The retirement age will be raised within two months to age 65.

Skywest upgrades WILL slowdown. 2% isn't that much for insurance.

Hey Seg- Skywest upgrades won't slow down. They have! LOL. It's gonna be real fun to see these kool aid 1000 hour wonders views change as QOL decreases with no upgrade in sight and no union to negotiate for them. When I was in transition in March the Dir of Flt Ops came in and said if you are planning on upgrading I recommend you do so now, cuz come fall, there ain't gonna be a whole lotta movement. But then again, this is the airline biz.

But hopefully, this will all happen once these clowns vote alpa down, then we can hear about them bitch about their problems for another 5 years when the next drive comes along.

 

[meritflyer]

Hey Seg- Skywest upgrades won't slow down. They have! LOL. It's gonna be real fun to see these kool aid 1000 hour wonders views change as QOL decreases with no upgrade in sight and no union to negotiate for them.

What does having a union have to do with upgrading?