SIC Type training

FL350

Well-Known Member
I am currently flying a Beech Premier jet and endorsing another pilot to get his SIC type on it. I realize where the type is officially needed, and I am rated with the single pilot type.

61.55 lists all the requirements for qualifying to get an six type. My question is regarding 61.55(h)(2):
"For the purpose of meeting the requirements of paragraph (b) of this section, a person may serve as second in command in that specific type aircraft, provided:

(1) The flight is conducted under day VFR or day IFR; and

(2) No person or property is carried on board the aircraft, other than necessary for conduct of the flight."

Does this mean that all their training must ONLY be conducted during the day? I hope I am misinterpreting something here, I'd want to give them some experience at night as well.
 

deadstick

Well-Known Member
I’d say “yes” for the initial training to complete the requirements of the SIC type. However, once you check those boxes, there’s notthung stopping you from getting the pilot some night experience. It’s redundant, but...welcome to FAA-think.

That being said, the Premier is a single-pilot aircraft and doesn’t require and SIC, as long as everything is working, right? So, unless something is deferred, 61.55 doesn’t exactly apply because an SIC isn’t required by certification or operation. Why the FAA hasn’t addressed such scenarios for SP aircraft is beyond me. The Citations 501/551 have been around since the late ‘70s.

Suggestion: do the ground in the morning. Do the required flight items about 4pm. Get dinner/paperwork and go back up for a few circuits after it’s dark.
 

FL350

Well-Known Member
I’d say “yes” for the initial training to complete the requirements of the SIC type. However, once you check those boxes, there’s notthung stopping you from getting the pilot some night experience. It’s redundant, but...welcome to FAA-think.

That being said, the Premier is a single-pilot aircraft and doesn’t require and SIC, as long as everything is working, right? So, unless something is deferred, 61.55 doesn’t exactly apply because an SIC isn’t required by certification or operation. Why the FAA hasn’t addressed such scenarios for SP aircraft is beyond me. The Citations 501/551 have been around since the late ‘70s.

Suggestion: do the ground in the morning. Do the required flight items about 4pm. Get dinner/paperwork and go back up for a few circuits after it’s dark.
thanks for the thoughts and idea. I had the same thoughts about the whole single pilot thing,but once again welcome to FAA-think.
Eventually he will be sent to school for a full PIC type.
 

dustoff17

Well-Known Member
@350,
Never heard back on this. Did you complete this training? I did a similar thing in a CE525 several years ago only to have it come back and bite me........
 
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dustoff17

Well-Known Member
What bit you?
Sorry, I should have just posted but I was hoping the OP would follow up. I’m not trolling.

I conducted similar SIC training in a 525; completed ground and flight portions, signed the logbook and 8710. The SoFL FSDO inspector went ballistic! He showed me where it is required and asked to see my FAA-approved training program. Drilled really deep into my past and records. AFTER he attained a certain level of disappointment that he couldn’t find anything to use against me, he started the lecture.

I was told that my ATP did not allow me to conduct the training, my training wasn’t FAA approved, that “the airplane doesn’t require an SIC” therefore, no SIC training was needed, and he denied the application.

Couldn’t really argue the FAR portion of his blubbering so I had to concede that part. I figured he was having a bad life so we left, I completed another 8710, drove to the Orlando FSDO and got it approved. The “SIC Only” certificate was issued but I did NOT mention the SoFL encounter to the Orlando Inspector.
 

Pilot Fighter

Well-Known Member
Sorry, I should have just posted but I was hoping the OP would follow up. I’m not trolling.

I conducted similar SIC training in a 525; completed ground and flight portions, signed the logbook and 8710. The SoFL FSDO inspector went ballistic! He showed me where it is required and asked to see my FAA-approved training program. Drilled really deep into my past and records. AFTER he attained a certain level of disappointment that he couldn’t find anything to use against me, he started the lecture.

I was told that my ATP did not allow me to conduct the training, my training wasn’t FAA approved, that “the airplane doesn’t require an SIC” therefore, no SIC training was needed, and he denied the application.

Couldn’t really argue the FAR portion of his blubbering so I had to concede that part. I figured he was having a bad life so we left, I completed another 8710, drove to the Orlando FSDO and got it approved. The “SIC Only” certificate was issued but I did NOT mention the SoFL encounter to the Orlando Inspector.
Thanks for the follow-up.

I still have questions about the rule. I understood the requirement for an approved 121 or 135 training program. The fact that "air transport service" is undefined and the requirement for both parties to be engaged in "air transport service" has led to some different interpretations. It doesn't say that both parties have to be employed by the same company and the approved training program may not include this stipulation. I saw this come up in a pre-employment check ride that was also intended to get the candidate current for an SIC.

In that case, the FAA didn't care.
 

deadstick

Well-Known Member
61.55(d) is the reference for 91 ops and 61.55(b) outlines the required material and tasks. For this, a “management” official can signoff the training. However, this seems to contradict 61.167(a)(2)(i).
 
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