Sad Realization

hmmm I'm Still using APG on the 727

not seeing the merger...the websites are still completely different along with the corporate HQ's
 
Bandit_Driver said:
Saab has begun installing a similar system for ICE on the Saab and recommends adding the speed on the approach. It has had some problems during it's roll out.

The E170 says the tail won't build ice, which is BS. I've landed with that tail pretty iced up in ORD


I still like the old school approach. If the pilot wants Engine or Wing A/I he or see can turn it on/off as needed. If you want install a simple ice prob on the aircraft to remind the pilot they are picking up ice
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I have heard about this ICE system, but have yet to see it.
 
Bandit_Driver said:
I still like the old school approach. If the pilot wants Engine or Wing A/I he or see can turn it on/off as needed. If you want install a simple ice prob on the aircraft to remind the pilot they are picking up ice
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The Glass DC9 is like this. There is an ice detector, but it is only to be used on the ground to decide if you can takeoff or not. Obviously we don't use it out here as we don't have a ground deice program for the plane. If it's less than 6 degrees C in visible moisture (in flight) we are supposed to turn on the engine anti ice and if we "think" we might pick up some ice, we power up the wings and tail.

And going way back in this thread, somebody correct me if I am wrong, but I thought that with a BFL takeoff, V1 will always equal VR.
 
BobDDuck said:
The Glass DC9 is like this. There is an ice detector, but it is only to be used on the ground to decide if you can takeoff or not. Obviously we don't use it out here as we don't have a ground deice program for the plane. If it's less than 6 degrees C in visible moisture (in flight) we are supposed to turn on the engine anti ice and if we "think" we might pick up some ice, we power up the wings and tail.

And going way back in this thread, somebody correct me if I am wrong, but I thought that with a BFL takeoff, V1 will always equal VR.
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Disregard. Not enough coffee yet
 
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Ok, coffee on board (it was chocolate milk)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balanced_field_takeoff

BFL is simply your accelerate go and accelerate stop distances being the same. If V1 and Vr are equal then it is not a balanced field (V1 is too high). Depending on the airplane V1 may be artificially adjusted up to maintain enough of a margin above Vmcg. So while a lower V1 would have resulted in a true balanced field, you wouldn't have been able to keep the airplane on the runway so up goes V1.

Start throwing in wet or slippery runways and you start lowering V1 to get a balanced field for accepting the longer accelerate go for the longer accelerate stop (less friction) or you just unbalance the field so that your available runway is long enough for your accelerate go/stop or 115% of a your all engines take off distance whichever is longer.
 
Unless we are reducing V1 for clutter V1 & VR are the same in the 727.

@BobDDuck 10C OAT and below with vis moisture the Engine A/I should be on during ground operations if your 9's are JT8 powered.

I've also wondered on the some of heavyweight takeoffs I've done how and the hell the 727 would stop in the remaining runway with vast majority of it behind before v1. I don't see 200,000 lbs stopping in a couple of thousand feet.
 
I was thinking the same thing last week out of SNA in a Pratt 757-200. 10K under max and runway limited. Just no way it would stop from V1. I think it would be cool if EMAS runways could have a fudge factor or adjustment for V1. With a financial incentive maybe more airports might get that stuff. Safety should not be secondary to the almighty dollar but that's how management will always see it....
 
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