Rude ATC

Relax folks, I don't see anything wrong the controller said. We don't know the complete context of the situation. The SNA controllers are great.
 
Seggy said:
Relax folks, I don't see anything wrong the controller said. We don't know the complete context of the situation. The SNA controllers are great.
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That's a SoCal guy. I've been lectured before as I'm sure everyone else has at some point in their aviation career. You either learn to live with it or dwell on it. I prefer to learn from it and move on.
 
Well, when you have a hard noise curfew because of your neighbors @amorris311, I understand why he may be a little anxious to get the guys who 'get lost' in that airspace out of the way.

Also, when someone says, "I have been doing this for 25 years and never...." my bullcrap meter is raised.
 
Seggy said:
Well, when you have a hard noise curfew because of your neighbors @amorris311, I understand why he may be a little anxious to get the guys who 'get lost' in that airspace out of the way.

Also, when someone says, "I have been doing this for 25 years and never...." my bullcrap meter is raised.
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Umm SNA is not my neighbor. That's filthy OC! :) My neighbors would be KTOA. Now they don't allow the sale of Jet-A just to keep those noise makers away. Then again Robinson enjoys test flying their new machines over the house and I'm starting to get sick of it. I'd rather listen to the Coast Guard roll slowly up and down the beach then those lawnmowers. :)
 
Sounds like a case of VFR getting into/far too near clouds and needing ATC help to get out/around. I don't think what ATC said was wrong. IMO the pilot, once seeing it's IFR ahead, should have just picked up an inflight IFR clearance to his destination / call flight service / etc.
 
FWIW if I'm the controller it sounded to me like the pilot is in VMC above a layer than is just enough to obscure his reference to the ground. He's slant U and looking for a heading to keep flying in the right direction knowing he has several holes to dive through, just not enough of the sight lines to navigate cleanly using a VOR. Maybe because I haven't been PIC in 12 years and I know what its like to be VFR sans GPS and because I know what its like to be the controller, I see no issue whatsoever with the pilot's request unless I'm missing something.

Didn't sound at all to me like inadvertent flight into IMC. Even the cocky non instrument rated pilots who stumble into the clouds sound at best confused. Guy was just looking for a heading and I've done the same myself. I don't know that local area at all, but the world seems different when you have obscured ground reference and a single VOR without DME. Believe me when I say there is a reason I prefer to ask if a VFR flight plan pilot knows the area/sees the airport. I've been that guy cut loose from flight following with a vague idea of where I am at night 25 miles out and just a little too chicken to say hang on to me just a little bit longer.
 
I heard some pretty annoyed controllers during the government shutdown when they had to come into work without pay.
 
No reason to rip the guy a new one. If he had time for all that, he could have said "Heading XYZ, but in the future note that we rarely have time to accommodate VFR requests" or something along those lines. Instead, he just gave the pilot the doubt fisted bird and left him hanging after. I sit at work and listen to SFO tower answer questions from VFR transitions in the surface Bravo during rush hour very often, never do they lose their cool like this guy. I'm sure he doesn't represent the norm at that facility...or at least I'd hope.
 
A good deal of my flying has been in SoCal and never had any controller lecture any pilot unless they were being unsafe like. Controllers will help you out when they can or tell you that they're swamped and can't help or will get to your request when they can.
 
H46Bubba said:
A good deal of my flying has been in SoCal and never had any controller lecture any pilot unless they were being unsafe like. Controllers will help you out when they can or tell you that they're swamped and can't help or will get to your request when they can.
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Almost all of my class B flying is with SFO and NorCal, but I do Bravo and Charlie transitions pretty much everytime I fly. They accommodate the vast majority of my requests, and when they can't, the controllers usually sincerely apologize and give me a reason very respectfully. It's not uncommon for Half Moon Bay to report clear and a bajillion only for a pilot to get there and find it socked in and have to make a 180 in the SFO surface bravo, usually the pilots are confused and obviously didn't plan on the divert. But again, it's always respectful. No reason not to be if the pilot isn't being a rude ass.
 
I think professionalism goes a long way in all fields, but especially in a field where things can go wrong in a second. Maybe the pilot did push beyond his limits, but to scald him like that over frequency is a very unprofessional way to go about business. If he was busy, a simple unable and maintain VFR would do, then that would let the pilot know he better circle or find VFR asap as he will then know the ball is in his park. Every now and then in the northwest weather can move in very quick, and the controllers either help us or let us know they are unable due to the volume of traffic they are dealing with at the moment. Just a low time pilots .02
 
Seggy said:
Relax folks, I don't see anything wrong the controller said. We don't know the complete context of the situation. The SNA controllers are great.
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True, but the controller didn't know the complete context of the pilot's situation.

If I make a mistake, rant away, I'll take my beating quietly.
 
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