Republic Hires 430 Hr Pilot!

AmazingPilot said:
Do what you can to feed the family?, this statement was made in reference to a new low-time pilot just starting out at the industry.
New pilots need to start gaining their expierence somewhere, and they need to start paying back loans as soon as possible.
New entry-level pilots are doing what they can to feed the family, pay the bills, or make a living.
The original poster was not talking about a united picket line.

Your statement is completely out of context.
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Seggy does have a point, though. But if we must debate that if taking an airline job at 300 hours is comparable to crossing a picket-line individually or through a company, from a "doing what they can to feed the family" stand-point, consider this:

You...(you as in everyone-I'm generalizing) you make the choice of getting into this industry. If you really have a problem with what's happening here, you can do what you can to feed the family and get a good paying job outside the airline or aviation industry. Taking a job at a regional with 300 TT is not the result of exhausting your every option to be a provider. It is a choice. You can choose to get more experience. You can choose to jump in now. You can choose to not fly for money at all. You can do whatever you want to do. It certainly isn't going to help you feed your family because the pay is super low and the pay certainly isn't going up because the airlines don't have to raise the pay if they can get all the 300TT pilots they want.
 
Seggy said:
So do WHATEVER you can to feed the family? What happens if United goes on strike tommorow? You would cross the picket line to 'feed the family'?
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kellwolf said:
I think you mean "accepted," then again it's obvious a lot of guys don't get hired for their grammar skills......

As for "whatever it takes to feed the family," I'm sure all the current Mesa guys working under crap work rules and wages totally forgive the guys that went to Freedom to "feed their families." Let's say Delta went on strike, and Skywest decided to fly those routes while they were on strike. Would you take the job to "feed your family?" If so, I wouldn't hold my breath on getting a job at Delta anytime in the future.....
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I was talking about accepting the first airline pilot job not crossing a picket line. From my previous posts you should know im all for striking. If pilots went on strike I would be right there picketing with them to improve pay. But as far as accepting my first airline job at 500 hrs, if someone thinks its disgusting or i don't belong there because im a low timer, too bad, im taking the job. If I pass training, IOE, and make it through my probationary year without captains complaining to the chief pilot that im an idiot and can't fly, I have every right to be in that seat. Simple supply and demand guys, supply and demand. Early 90s too many pilots, too little jobs, minimums are like 3,000TT. Now we have too many jobs and too little pilots, minimums are below 1,000. And we don't have too little pilots because of the pay, its because of expansion. Raise pay and bring every out of the industry and overseas pilot back we'll still have a shortage. Supply and demand.
 
Multi Sim...ATP rapes their students during training and puts them in the sim to steal more money from them.
 
falconvalley said:
Seggy does have a point, though. But if we must debate that if taking an airline job at 300 hours is comparable to crossing a picket-line individually or through a company, from a "doing what they can to feed the family" stand-point, consider this:

You...(you as in everyone-I'm generalizing) you make the choice of getting into this industry. If you really have a problem with what's happening here, you can do what you can to feed the family and get a good paying job outside the airline or aviation industry. Taking a job at a regional with 300 TT is not the result of exhausting your every option to be a provider. It is a choice. You can choose to get more experience. You can choose to jump in now. You can choose to not fly for money at all. You can do whatever you want to do. It certainly isn't going to help you feed your family because the pay is super low and the pay certainly isn't going up because the airlines don't have to raise the pay if they can get all the 300TT pilots they want.
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Would you agree with this statement...

Pay should be on par with expierence.

I think pay and salaries are rock bottom and I do think they should be better.
The only way to get to the majors is through gaining expierence at the regional airline level. Not saying this is everyone's goal, but expierence needs to be gained. Regional pay is low, but at leasts it's steady and affords some type of financial security. Flying commercial or instructing is unreliable at best, so you can't fault pilots who are eager to break-in to the industry.
That being said I think 250 hours is extremly low, however training is going to be the same for all newhires. If the 300TT pilot is in over his/her head then that pilot will washout.
Keep in mind, before you label new hires as scabs, remember that most new regional pilots don't have an indepth understanding airline politics.
 
777forever said:
I was talking about accepting the first airline pilot job not crossing a picket line. From my previous posts you should know im all for striking. If pilots went on strike I would be right there picketing with them to improve pay. But as far as accepting my first airline job at 500 hrs, if someone thinks its disgusting or i don't belong there because im a low timer, too bad, im taking the job. If I pass training, IOE, and make it through my probationary year without captains complaining to the chief pilot that im an idiot and can't fly, I have every right to be in that seat. Simple supply and demand guys, supply and demand. Early 90s too many pilots, too little jobs, minimums are like 3,000TT. Now we have too many jobs and too little pilots, minimums are below 1,000. And we don't have too little pilots because of the pay, its because of expansion. Raise pay and bring every out of the industry and overseas pilot back we'll still have a shortage. Supply and demand.
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How do you know we'll still have a shortage? Supply and demand is affected by more than just 2 things anyway. It's not that simple.
 
777forever said:
You have no clue what you are talking about. Did you go to ATP?
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No, please describe where I am wrong.

Those sims are paid for. It costs ATP nothing to operate them. I personally think Sim time for the MULTI PRIVATE is a joke.

Secondly...the program is way overpriced for what you get. How much time did you get in the actual airplane?
 
AmazingPilot said:
Would you agree with this statement...

Pay should be on par with expierence.

I think pay and salaries are rock bottom and I do think they should be better.
The only way to get to the majors is through gaining expierence at the regional airline level. Not saying this is everyone's goal, but expierence needs to be gained. Regional pay is low, but at leasts it's steady and affords some type of financial security. Flying commercial or instructing is unreliable at best, so you can't fault pilots who are eager to break-in to the industry.
That being said I think 250 hours is extremly low, however training is going to be the same for all newhires. If the 300TT pilot is in over his/her head then that pilot will washout.
Keep in mind, before you label new hires as scabs, remember that most new regional pilots don't have an indepth understanding airline politics.
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And I would say everything you just said to me...to you. I didn't state how I felt or use jargon. I simply said that people have a choice. And by making the choice to fly for a regional, it's not to feed the family. It's to fly for an airline. I didn't say I disagreed with it. I didn't say I agreed with it. You should see what I've had to go through just to fly for a living and feed myself. My choices haven't always been easy, so I know...
 
SmitteyB said:
No, please describe where I am wrong.

Those sims are paid for. It costs ATP nothing to operate them. I personally think Sim time for the MULTI PRIVATE is a joke.

Secondly...the program is way overpriced for what you get. How much time did you get in the actual airplane?
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126.6 ME for me out of the promised 140. Some people I knew would log the XC time same as the Pilot flying so they ended up getting close to 140 or a few even more. The reason why they put you in the sim is to basically let you get used to the flows first before going in the actual plane, and the sims we used were soo ultra sensitive if you can shoot a non-presicion approach with that descently you can do better in the actual a/c.
 
SmitteyB said:
No, please describe where I am wrong.

Those sims are paid for. It costs ATP nothing to operate them. I personally think Sim time for the MULTI PRIVATE is a joke.

Secondly...the program is way overpriced for what you get. How much time did you get in the actual airplane?
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While I don't disagree with any of what you say here. Many people have been very satisfied with the results they got training at ATP. People do get hired pretty early on also, so there are positives to their program.
 
777forever said:
Are you kidding?
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When I interviewed for X national airline for the internship, the applicants and the HR person was surprised by the ammount of multi time that I had. I think it helps, especially when MOST, if not all aviation universities leave you with 35-60ME time.
 
desertdog71 said:
While I don't disagree with any of what you say here. Many people have been very satisfied with the results they got training at ATP. People do get hired pretty early on also, so there are positives to their program.
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And I have no doubt ATP puts out top notch pilots and their program is proven and works...but

The argument is mainly about price and the amount of Sim time.

50 hours of sim time and a rediculously low rate for them. Im just asking you to break down the price, thats all.
 
SmitteyB said:
No, please describe where I am wrong.

Those sims are paid for. It costs ATP nothing to operate them. I personally think Sim time for the MULTI PRIVATE is a joke.

Secondly...the program is way overpriced for what you get. How much time did you get in the actual airplane?
Click to expand...

I don't even know what to tell you except to go to the ATP forum and ATP website to do some research before we have an educated conversation about this. By the way, sim time for my multi-addon was free and it also is when I do my CFI program in Vegas:)
 
SmitteyB said:
And I have no doubt ATP puts out top notch pilots and their program is proven and works...but

The argument is mainly about price and the amount of Sim time.

50 hours of sim time and a rediculously low rate for them. Im just asking you to break down the price, thats all.
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Don't ask me, I paid about $25,000 less than ATP prices. :)
 
777forever said:
I don't even know what to tell you except to go to the ATP forum and ATP website to do some research before we have an educated conversation about this. By the way, sim time for my multi-addon was free and it also is when I do my CFI program in Vegas:)
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You're surprised by that? It doesn't cost them anything. They're not losing money.

Sim reacts NOTHING like an airplane.
 
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