So I got to thinking, If a mooney was available for rental... how many people would bite... There is no specific dollar figure attached. How many people would rent a mooney if they could? Or if that don't float your boat what kind of plane would you want to rent the most... Single or Multi doesn't matter. Annnnnnnnnnnnd Go!
Renting a Mooney
- Thread starter MFS
- Start date
KSCessnaDriver
Well-Known Member
What kind of Mooney? Short body, medium, or long? 180-200 horsepower up to like 310 horsepower. Long story short, need more information before one could make a judgment.
jrh
Well-Known Member
I think you're asking the wrong people.
Most pilots on this forum are interested in renting a plane for training or timebuilding. Most Mooneys aren't particularly good choices for either.
If you want to put a Mooney on a rental line, you need to talk to the pilots who are already in your area and renting other planes for business and personal travel. Find out how many of them have a use for a faster cross country machine. That will give you a better idea of the demand.
Also, if you are simply looking to make money with a rental plane, it's really hard to beat a Cessna 172. They're so versatile, regardless of the demographic or type of flying done in your area. As long as you manage and market it carefully, it's almost guaranteed to fly.
Or, if you really are just wanting off the wall answers...my vote would be a Super Decathlon. You'll never make money with it, and it's only a matter of time before a renter ground loops it, but it would be a heck of a lot of fun.
Okie_Pilot
Pitts Builder
Well...
You could use it for complex endorsements, if it's 200+hp (I believe) it could also be used for high performance endorsements.
On the other side of the fence, to solo the plane they would need both of those endorsements and I don't even want to imagine the insurance costs on insuring a Mooney for rental. Especially if this is the sole plane you plan on renting.
You could use it for complex endorsements, if it's 200+hp (I believe) it could also be used for high performance endorsements.
On the other side of the fence, to solo the plane they would need both of those endorsements and I don't even want to imagine the insurance costs on insuring a Mooney for rental. Especially if this is the sole plane you plan on renting.
ILS37R
Well-Known Member
It would really depend on the specific type and price point. It's not a plane that would be used for much training activity, so there'd need to be a niche for business/pleasure cross-countries in your region. I personally probably would not rent it due to the need for a not insignificant checkout in it, and my expectation of rental cost. For a more expensive rental, I'd be more interested in a Stationair or a Cherokee 6 (or whatever Piper is calling them right now). Maybe a Seneca. Basically a plane that can actually take four adults, bags and some fuel.
swisspilot
Well-Known Member
In the Atlanta area I saw a nice short body going for 70$ dry, I think it was in PDK.....
I think jhr got it right, a cessna 172 or a PA28 are really the best planes for this kind of things. The bigger and the faster and things start getting complicated with insurance and training required to rent the plane, some of the C206 I saw for rent go for as much you would pay for two 172s....
Blackhawk
Well-Known Member
Some American Flyer schools use to operate M-20Rs- not sure if they still do. In some areas of the country there might be enough of a demand for an airplane such as a Mooney that it could be supported. If you google Mooney rentals you will see them primarily in the larger cities- at least the late models. I did look into putting an M-20S with a nAspen panel on line for a client but the check out requirements and the amount he was going to have to charge to just break even kind of killed the idea in my market.
Well there is your first problem. With an airplane like a Mooney, you rent it to offset the costs. I know, I know, the objective is to make money, but in most cases, it's either not possible, or just not practical.
NJA_Capt
Well-Known Member
I would consider a Mooney. I have been looking for a (nice) traveling airplane for me and the family, but there are none around (that aren't in an expensive flying club). I would like to see a F33A/A36. If you did what you are thinking, specify higher mins so it is not used for flight training (ie...2000+ tt).
I have been looking for over a year. I don't currently rent, so polling current renters might not be a accurate evaluation. I would wager that more people are abstaining vs renting what is currently available.
KSCessnaDriver
Well-Known Member
Wow, 2000 that's really steep, and likely to be well above the number of hours a good portion of the rental clientele have? Heck, if you look around in the right places, you can find an older PA46 or two for rent at 500TT. Even a brand new Acclaim S shouldn't have more than 500 TT, with a decent amount of dual in type attached to it.
Blackhawk
Well-Known Member
Which is why you are seeing fewer and fewer airplanes for rent in some markets. No point in an owner letting others rent his/her airplane at a loss.
Douglas
Old School KSUX
Yep. You would really need to pick the age and model to see if it will fit in your market.
KSCessnaDriver
Well-Known Member
Exactly. Heck, if somebody had a C or E model for rent, they might do ok on it, especially if there is a lot of commercial training going on in the area. When it comes down to it, I don't think the costs of an early Arrow or Mooney are all that different.
But on the other hand, I don't see too much of a market for a rental G1000 Mooney, just because of the price its going to command.
NJA_Capt
Well-Known Member
That's exactly why I would put high mins on it. With a 300-800K airplane, I don't want it being used for training or guys just renting it to band around. It would be for traveling, professional people who are using it as a business asset.
I've never seen/heard of a rental PA46. It is hard to imagine someone renting a Malibu to someone with 500 hrs. I'm going to guess they have very LOW coverage.
jrh
Well-Known Member
This is why you only see this caliber of aircraft in major metropolitan areas. I'm in a city of 250,000, with another city of half a million people nearby, and we don't have a single renter with more than 1000 TT. Once you require more than 500 TT, you're basically limiting the rental customers to professional pilots. There aren't many of those floating around.
KSCessnaDriver
Well-Known Member
I understand not wanting training going on in something like a 700K Mooney, but at 2000 hours, the only people who really have that kind of time are either going to have the money to own a plane themselves, or be a career pilot. Financially, I just don't see that working out at a 2000 hour minimum, unless the owner of the plane just needs a method to take losses to offset income from something else.
But in regards to PA46's. There is at least one in San Diego that is at 500 TT, 100 complex and 10 make/model. Granted, its a flight club, but its a very large flight club.
drunkenbeagle
Gang Member
As almost everyone else is saying, almost none. Insurance will be super expensive, and you won't find many potential renters with experience in a Mooney other than - someone that has already owned a Mooney. And they don't still own it, the probably bought something bigger and faster.
A Turbo 182T or 206 will be easier to rent out, but you will still lose money on it.
I think an Arrow probably makes the best sense economically - it is reasonably fast X/C and has a decent useful load, but will still get you some business doing Comm/CFI instruction (A Mooney will be too expensive to compete in that market)
A Turbo 182T or 206 will be easier to rent out, but you will still lose money on it.
I think an Arrow probably makes the best sense economically - it is reasonably fast X/C and has a decent useful load, but will still get you some business doing Comm/CFI instruction (A Mooney will be too expensive to compete in that market)
Most lease backs are done to offset ownership costs, not to make money. It's very hard to make money with any airplane for the small time guy. If you own a fleet of airplanes that are cheap to operate and there are tons and tons of them out there, ala-172, then it can be done. The other alternative is to work out something with the insurance company that the renter has to carry insurance as well as the operator. That way the insurance for the operator is affordable, and you can bring the rental rate down to a livable price. But even then, it's at best a break even deal. You can use the airplane as a rental to cover maintenence items, like annuals and overhauls, so the owner only needs to pay a small portion of those costs vs having to foot the whole bill.
Plenty of mooney's to rent, and actually making money off of it. Also SuperDecathlons. But you have to be in the right geographical area 
For instance http://flysundance.org/fleet.html#bsingle
For instance http://flysundance.org/fleet.html#bsingle