Remember3407Project

F

Firebird2XC

Well-Known Member
... okay, a little slow on my part. Website's fixed.

Expect an update as soon as I figure out what I did to WinSCP.

In the meantime, bringing the website back online brought me this.

Here's a tribute to those lost in the crash of Colgan Air flight 3407.

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Good for you Charlie. Don't stop. I saw on another forum that a certain aviation college sent out a letter to all their flight students, and subsequently held a meeting, necessitating the need to write their officials so that said program can be exempt from a few "rules"
 
B767 said:
I saw on another forum that a certain aviation college sent out a letter to all their flight students, and subsequently held a meeting, necessitating the need to write their officials so that said program can be exempt from a few "rules"
Click to expand...

:mad: :chair: :soapbox:
 
[pause circle jerk]
Do you blame them? Honestly?
They were throwing out random ass total time numbers just like everyone else.
It's like the price is right. $5.01 Bob. When you're dealing with arbitrary numbers you can't be surprised that a university who teaches beyond the bare minimum and charges a crap load for it would want some leverage.

[/pause circle jerk]
 
mikecweb said:
[pause circle jerk]
Do you blame them? Honestly?
They were throwing out random ass total time numbers just like everyone else.
It's like the price is right. $5.01 Bob. When you're dealing with arbitrary numbers you can't be surprised that a university who teaches beyond the bare minimum and charges a crap load for it would want some leverage.

[/pause circle jerk]
Click to expand...


So who decides to what 'higher standard' one must teach before one is exempted from the rules?

This is all about marketing, period. There's big money in it for those schools. Do you really think they care that much about the moral issues of it?

I don't see how after four years they can't find a way to get somebody more than the minimum number of hours.

A scam is a scam. They're selling a 'competitive advantage' by giving more thorough training. They're just looking to gain an additional advantage by seeking exemption. If the rule is in play and they're the only ones with the exception, suddenly they're that much more marketable than their competitors.

Follow the money. That's all their angle is about.
 
Kristie said:
Do you need some website help Charlie?
Click to expand...

Eh, yeah, actually. Between you and Spiramirabilis I'd probably have a much easier time of things.

Ideas for the site?

I need to update the news links and the 'Goals' section with a progress update.
 
Firebird2XC said:
So who decides to what 'higher standard' one must teach before one is exempted from the rules?

This is all about marketing, period. There's big money in it for those schools. Do you really think they care that much about the moral issues of it?

I don't see how after four years they can't find a way to get somebody more than the minimum number of hours.

A scam is a scam. They're selling a 'competitive advantage' by giving more thorough training. They're just looking to gain an additional advantage by seeking exemption. If the rule is in play and they're the only ones with the exception, suddenly they're that much more marketable than their competitors.

Follow the money. That's all their angle is about.
Click to expand...
Brilliant research. Obviously it's their angle because of money. What they are doing though is throwing numbers just like y'all are for required hours. No difference in what you are proposing. A 4 year degree in aeronautics is also worth some weight, according to them and many others.
You discount that because it's big bad ERAU behind it but there is some merit to study this crap for four years in school. Collegiate Aviation has alot of pluses. A big minus is the cost but that shouldn't mean it's completely inept. Some people don't fit in or can't be successful in a structured enviornment such as UND and ERAU. That's fine but you can't dispute the claim that studying this crap for 4 years and getting a degree in it isn't worth anything.
 
mikecweb said:
A 4 year degree in aeronautics is also worth some weight, according to them and many others.

That's fine but you can't dispute the claim that studying this crap for 4 years and getting a degree in it isn't worth anything.
Click to expand...

I'd agree with the above. The big thing I don't like about this deal that ERAU is pushing, is that they think their flight department is better. Last time I checked, everyone in the country uses the same practical test standards for private, instrument, commercial, multi-engine and flight instructor ratings. I fail to see how they can unilaterally say the pilots they train are better than those who go through a different school.

Plus, I think the whole waiver for the ATP requirement is utterly ridiculous, now that I've thought about it. I hope the letter writing campaign that was undertaken at this school (ERAU) is a disaster. I hope they don't succeed in getting a wavier for the school. Everyone should have to play by the same game. Don't give somebody a chance to buy their way past the game.
 
A 4 year degree in aeronautics is worth just the same as a 4 year degree in basket weaving, IMHO. It's a box you have to check off. It shouldn't reduce the requirements to get an ATP at all.

If you want to say that all ATPs should be college graduates, I could get on board with that. (I still need to finish online classes for mine.)
 
mikecweb said:
Brilliant research. Obviously it's their angle because of money. What they are doing though is throwing numbers just like y'all are for required hours. No difference in what you are proposing. A 4 year degree in aeronautics is also worth some weight, according to them and many others.
You discount that because it's big bad ERAU behind it but there is some merit to study this crap for four years in school. Collegiate Aviation has alot of pluses. A big minus is the cost but that shouldn't mean it's completely inept. Some people don't fit in or can't be successful in a structured enviornment such as UND and ERAU. That's fine but you can't dispute the claim that studying this crap for 4 years and getting a degree in it isn't worth anything.
Click to expand...

It's not really worth that much, you're right. All it does is pretty much breed arrogant pilots, and those who instruct do so not to teach, but to build time...
 
mikecweb said:
Brilliant research. Obviously it's their angle because of money. What they are doing though is throwing numbers just like y'all are for required hours. No difference in what you are proposing. A 4 year degree in aeronautics is also worth some weight, according to them and many others.
You discount that because it's big bad ERAU behind it but there is some merit to study this crap for four years in school. Collegiate Aviation has alot of pluses. A big minus is the cost but that shouldn't mean it's completely inept. Some people don't fit in or can't be successful in a structured enviornment such as UND and ERAU. That's fine but you can't dispute the claim that studying this crap for 4 years and getting a degree in it isn't worth anything.
Click to expand...


I think the knowledge base is solid. I've got two years with ERAU myself. Pro Aero major with minor in Aviation Safety.

I'll finish it one of these days.

I'd argue that the knowledge base makes them a better aviator on paper, but without some degree of real-world experience, there's no way to test the theory.

Devil's advocate- would you support putting a 4 year aviation college grad in the LEFT seat of an airliner with a reduced experience requirement?

You can't deny the financial aspect of this- aviation colleges are big money.
 
cencal83406 said:
It's not really worth that much, you're right. All it does is pretty much breed arrogant pilots, and those who instruct do so not to teach, but to build time...
Click to expand...


I've seen some fairly arrogant pilots that never went near the 4 year schools.

The attitude of the individual is the individual's fault, not the school's.

Yes, the school might sell them a certain amount of esprit d'corps, but ultimately what the individual does with that is up to them.
 
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