Regional Airlines Seek Reduced Minimum Pilot-Experience Mandate

Mike Wise

#NewSchool
From the WSJ:

U.S. regional airlines seek to persuade regulators to ease experience requirements for hiring many future co-pilots, while proposing to significantly enhance training and supervision once the aviators start flying passengers.

The initiative lays out a potential alternate path to the cockpit for starting pilots that includes time sitting in airliner jump seats as observers, more-frequent proficiency checks by carriers, beefed-up stall-recovery training and a year or more of formal mentoring by senior pilots.

Primary elements of the plan, which hadn’t been previously reported, were laid out in draft documents and in interviews with officials of the Regional Airline Association, the trade group advocating such changes.

In the U.S., fledgling pilots usually pay to log hours in smaller aircraft in order to apply for an airline job and then receive training on specific commercial aircraft. But like other critics of the existing regulatory structure, regional airline leaders have argued many prospective pilots are discouraged by the fact that it typically takes several years and often more than $120,000 to build up the necessary hours.

“I don’t think I have a single carrier that has not been impacted” by dwindling pilot availability, said association head Faye Malarkey Black, whose group represents some two dozen regional carriers across North America. They operate roughly half of all passenger flights nationwide.

Mainline carriers worry that a slew of pilot retirements by the end of the decade could thin their aviator ranks. But so far the big airlines have been able to tap a steady stream of the more-experienced pilots coming from smaller affiliates.

With regional carriers pledging to step up both initial and recurrent training programs for new co-pilots, or first officers, the goal is to raise the safety bar while fixing “a broken pipeline” that is already producing too few acceptable applicants, Ms. Black said in an interview Tuesday.

“We want all new pilots to be better trained,” she said, adding that proponents want this to be an industrywide solution that is “safer because we leave nothing to chance.”

Aiming to challenge the currently mandated 1,500-hour flight-timestandard for all U.S. airline pilots—perhaps the most controversial issue confronting the country’s carriers—the association over the past few months quietly assembled a package designed to alleviate what its members describe as a worsening shortage of would-be first officers.

Expected to be formally presented to the Federal Aviation Administration after more details are hammered out, the current proposal doesn’t specify alternate flight-time requirements for candidates who would participate in individual airline-run programs. At this point FAA policy makers, as well as an agency-sponsored labor-industry advisory committee, appear opposed to dramatic reductions in mandatory experience for average new cockpit hires.

Under provisions previously endorsed by lawmakers and regulators, former military pilots and graduates of four-year college or university aviation programs already can cut minimum-experience requirements by hundreds of hours.

The proposal takes a different tack compared with another recently disclosed attempt, by JetBlue Airways Corp. to recruit students without any cockpit experience and immerse them in airline-style training to show proficiency can be achieved with far fewer hours than the FAA and Congress now demand.

Details of the latest package called ACE, standing for air carrier enhanced training, have been disclosed in private briefings to lawmakers and regulators. The plan takes students with time in small airplanes and then subjects them to a training technique widely relied on by foreign airlines but traditionally shunned in the U. S: Having trainees sit in jump seats as a way to become familiar with cockpit practices and air-traffic control procedures.

In addition, new co-pilots would be subject to proficiency checks every six months, rather than today’s typical annual schedule. They would fly passengers under the direct supervision of senior captains, called check airmen, for twice as long as current practice.

Also, during their first year of employment, they would be subject to continuing evaluations by regular captains and data would be collected from these assessments.

The ACE package also includes more training emphasis on hot-button safety topics such as improving manual flying skills, responding to high-altitude stalls, recovering from extreme upsets and better understanding aerodynamic and human factors principles.

The Air Line Pilots Association, the largest North American pilot union, remains opposed to wholesale reductions in experience for entry-level aviators. President Tim Canoll has said that preserving the 1,500-hour mandate is one of ALPA’s top priorities. For years, union leaders have strongly urged FAA officials to resist industry pressure to lower that threshold.

According to Ms. Black, regional carriers gradually have changed some training regimes to reflect greater knowledge and causes of recent accidents. “It is a collaborative effort” with labor and regulators, she said, and “we’ve done some due diligence” to pave the way for the eventual final proposal.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/regiona...edminimum-pilot-experience-mandate-1449005336

I wonder how this will turn out for them.
 
I can't speak for others, but the new ATP requirements are more of a blessing than a curse to me. They've forced me to become a more well-rounded pilot by flying Alaskan freight in a dinky old turboprop, medevac in Lears and automotive freight out of DTW in Falcons...as well as teach Chinese cadets (whose solos were probably the scariest thing that I've EVER done so far in aviation LOL). I would NEVER have experienced those aspects of aviation if I could have gone to a regional right out of flight school. That said, It HAS kept me from building seniority at an airline by not heading down that route earlier, but I don't think I will appreciate the airline gig that I about to pursue as eagerly now as had I NOT tangled through all that. I am not special or gifted by any means, in fact I'll even say I'm woefully average as countless others have done the same or WAY more than me and yeah, they're luckier/better. But heck I am just REALLY thankful that I am about to break ATP mins in a couple of months and it has been a heck of ride getting (almost) there, I just hope I can say that I earned it through hard work, and for their information, we already have reduced mins: all the university 141 flight school grads qualify for Restricted minimums, so management needs to stop complaining about lowering mins even further, because they already are reduced and if get hired with less than that, you're only cheating yourself.

Not trying to start a huge debate over this as I'm sure many of us got hired at the regionals with less than 1000 hours and they're fantastic pilots and people overall, but that's just my perspective on this through my own experiences. Peace out, y'all.
 
The rule isn't, companies that refuse to pay a live able wage and treat their employees well are. Plenty of talent, just belly up to the table and increase wages and work rules.
It's the majors who refuse to pay more for their feed, the regionals aren't withholding pay out of greed, their slim margins make it almost impossible.

Until it actually starts affecting the mainlines it won't change anything, musical airplanes, shuffle pilots around, stick some duct tape on the gaping hole to slow the leak. Eventually they'll have to address it, whether it be pay the regionals more or bring it back in house, probably a bit of both. If it gets to the point where regionals are no longer cost effective to farm out to then they'll dry up anyway.

I just don't know where the money is gonna come from.
 
I'm a republican/conservative and I believe the only way for the airlines to ever get it right is to go back to regulation. Not the route structure, but fares, pay, staffing, all need some form of oversight. It won't happen and the bloodbath will continue.

It's a service industry, but behaves more like a commodity.

I personally hope average ticket prices double, regionals go away--for good, and the Walmart fliers go home, never to be seen again. This could happen.
 
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That said, It HAS kept me from building seniority at an airline by not heading down that route earlier, but I don't think I will appreciate the airline gig that I about to pursue as eagerly now as had I NOT tangled through all that.

Remember that your seniority was pushed back by the same amount as everybody else and that your number will be right around the exact same people as it would have been without the rule change. Everybody in your class will be hired at 1500 hours instead of that same class being hired at 250.
 
Good or bad, it's decimating smaller markets.

Please pass this along....GOOD!

I am doubtful though that these smaller markets are blaming incompetent regional airline management though for putting these smaller markets in the situation they are in.
Tell these smaller markets to start subsidizing airlines to bring in mainline service, flown by mainline employees, with mainline ground personal. Until they start doing that, don't expect me to give them any sympathy.
 
Please pass this along....GOOD!

I am doubtful though that these smaller markets are blaming incompetent regional airline management though for putting these smaller markets in the situation they are in.
Tell these smaller markets to start subsidizing airlines to bring in mainline service, flown by mainline employees, with mainline ground personal. Until they start doing that, don't expect me to give them any sympathy.

Some markets do in fact. Savannah subsidizes B6's flights to JFK, and CMH pays Southwest for their SFO (or OAK - can't remember) service. These markets would certainly love to have mainline if they can get them.

The more interesting trend is airports selling out to Allegiant, which in turn makes them less desirable to other carriers (mainline or regional). Kinda like when you were playing Sim City and your town was so broke that you started building nuclear waste sites and what not, and then nobody wanted to live in your city anymore.
 
Some markets do in fact. Savannah subsidizes B6's flights to JFK, and CMH pays Southwest for their SFO (or OAK - can't remember) service. These markets would certainly love to have mainline if they can get them.

Good. More markets need to do this or else they should stop bitching.

The more interesting trend is airports selling out to Allegiant, which in turn makes them less desirable to other carriers (mainline or regional). Kinda like when you were playing Sim City and your town was so broke that you started building nuclear waste sites and what not, and then nobody wanted to live in your city anymore.

Interesting. Is that because Allegiant drives down the fares and no one wants to compete with those said fares?
 
I'm a republican/conservative and I believe the only way for the airlines to ever get it right is to go back to regulation. Not the route structure, but fares, pay, staffing, all need some form of oversight. It won't happen and the bloodbath will continue.

It's a service industry, but behaves more like a commodity.

I personally hope average ticket prices double, regionals go away--for good, and the Walmart fliers go home, never to be seen again. This could happen.
You can't be a "republican" and want regulations. Now as a "Conservative"; that I can see.

There are many other industries the government could regulate. Would you support that as well? The medical field comes to mind.
 
There is a real problem today of jobs that will get you to 1500 hours. We may say that there are qualified people out there that would go to Regionals at the right price, but they have to do 1500 hours worth of training and even lower paying jobs. So the hill is still to steep for most to have any real intrests of climbing it all the way to the Regionals. I think they should revisit the rule.
 
There is a real problem today of jobs that will get you to 1500 hours. We may say that there are qualified people out there that would go to Regionals at the right price, but they have to do 1500 hours worth of training and even lower paying jobs. So the hill is still to steep for most to have any real intrests of climbing it all the way to the Regionals. I think they should revisit the rule.

Yes and no.

Historically, 1500 hours is kind of low for getting on with the regionals. Most of the captains I flew with had huge amounts of hours before they were hired. But at the same time, there are infinitely less people interested in learning how to fly. In places where the weather isn't terrible, 2 years of instructing yields at least 1500TT, but without students...

All things considered, this is a good rule for everybody. Even if it doesn't actually bring in a higher quality applicant, it forces the issue with the mainline carriers. I don't think we've reached the point yet, but we will. This flying should be done by mainline, and I think Delta has proved that It can be.
 
You could make the starting pay for the regionals 50K a year, but if "I" have to eat ramen noodles for 4 years while I buzz around the patch, its not likely to happen. I know the outcome we would all like to happen, and that's raise wages, more mainline flying etc, and while some of that may happen, in a lot of cases the companies will get creative instead. They'll lobby for 67, they'll push for cabotage, and something else we haven't even considered.
 
When I was applying to the regionals and instructing, practically all the CFI's I was rubbing elbows with had 1000+ TT and were working toward 100+ multi. This was 2005-ish. Lots of hiring going on, similar to today. Most guys were getting picked up right around 135 mins as long as you had 100+ multi. In fact, I moved up significantly faster back then than guys who are currently getting hired at my ex-commuter are. Tons of expansion at the commuter level, Republic/SkyWest getting 70 seaters, ExpressJet hiring by the dozens, etc.

I remember I applied to Republic with >ATP mins, 200+ multi, currently instructing in the A36/BE58, they were the only place that didn't call me. I had two guys walk my stuff in even. They were hiring 135 freight guys almost exclusively from the guys I knew hired on there. I was hired at my commuter with ~1900 hours, I was the mid-time guy there. Some were only CFIs, some flew freight, some were former (crappy) 121.

Lots of guys did the ATP route, zero to MEI in what, <1 year, instruct for 6-10 months, then pick which commuter you want.

The notion that guys didn't work for peanuts, building up time is bunk. We all did it because we had to, because that was the market. There were shortcuts (JetU) but they didn't furnish most of the candidates. Only one guy in my new hire class did the pay for type rating thing.
 
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