Rats - ticket

ZapBrannigan

ZapBrannigan

If it ain’t a Boeing, I’m not going. No choice.
47 in a 35 fair and square. What do you think? Do I bother going to court? Pros and cons?

I've heard that they may allow me to go to traffic school in exchange for removing it from my record. If that's the case does it still need to be reported on job applications that specifically ask about moving violations?

Thanks
 
It depends on what you hope to achieve.

If you want to save time, put a check in the envelope and forget it.

If you want to save points on your license or ensure your insurance rates don't go up, go to one of the traffic law centers. Those are the slimy little lawyers (actually that was probably redundant) who take your case to court and pay extra in exchange for having your ticket changed to parking or a loud muffler. The court gets more money, the lawyer gets to stick his dirty hand in your wallet, and you don't get any points on your license. Justice is twisted like a pretzel, but everyone walks away happy.

If you want to save money, but have lots of time to waste and you understand the system, go to court. But, there are a lot of "it depends" in there. If the court you take it to is the same one that issued the ticket, that is one thing. On the other hand, if the people who issued the ticket are a municipality and you can have it moved to county court, then they will come in and play "let's make a deal" with you. Again, it depends a lot on who gave you the ticket and how the courts are set up in that area.
 
My goal? I'd like to save money and avoid having to put it on a Delta application at some point in the future.

Was a city police officer (small town) and the citation says to go to that city district court to show or pay. :(
 
While it is my "opinion" that one time would not make a difference to the FAA, read question 18v from the medical application:

18v. Yes / No - History of (1) any arrest(s) and/or conviction(s) involving driving while intoxicated by, while impaired by, or while under the influence of alcohol or a drug; or (2) history of any arrest(s), and/or conviction(s),and/or administrative action(s) involving an offense(s) which resulted in the denial, suspension, cancellation, or revocation of driving privileges or which resulted in attendance at an educational or a rehabilitation program.
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So, if you go into court and try to get into a driver's education program, you MIGHT be worse off than if you just paid the fine.

Based on your desires, my recommendation based on limited knowledge of the court system is to contact one of those traffic law lawyers and be prepared to write a check or two that is more than you should have to pay for such an event. At least then it will go away and become a loud muffler or parking fine.

(See Private Message for LONG Answer)

So, whatever happens, I wish you the best of luck. Be sure and let us know what you decide to do.
 
Looks like that question from the medical application deals specifically with driving while intoxicated or otherwise under the influence.

I was stone cold sober, just out for a Sunday drive with my family in the car and didn't see the sign.

Most likely will just pay it and move on. Just wondering what other options I might have.
 
That isn't the way I read that question. Start after the word "or" and see if it looks that way to you. Of course, this isn't my part of the forest, so for a readout on that question, it would be best to ask the flight surgeon.
 
One ticket makes you human, ten a legend. I'm pretty sure the above rule on medical is dui involved. NA I would say :def:
 
My $0.02, there's nothing to be lost by going to court yourself. (with the possible exception of a slightly higher court cost). I would enter a NG plea, go to court and ask to speak to the prosecutor. Tell him how this may impact future job prospects and see if he will amend the charge to a non moving violation. Worst thing he can say is no.

If he says no just change your plea to guilty and pay it.

Cost you probably 25 in court cost and a half day wasted, I'd hate to pay a lawyer for something I could do myself.

I can't say this is possible everywhere but it happens all the time in our court. You might want to check with local folks for their experience with that court.

Good luck either way.
 
web265 said:
My $0.02, there's nothing to be lost by going to court yourself. (with the possible exception of a slightly higher court cost). I would enter a NG plea, go to court and ask to speak to the prosecutor. Tell him how this may impact future job prospects and see if he will amend the charge to a non moving violation. Worst thing he can say is no.

If he says no just change your plea to guilty and pay it.

Cost you probably 25 in court cost and a half day wasted, I'd hate to pay a lawyer for something I could do myself.

I can't say this is possible everywhere but it happens all the time in our court. You might want to check with local folks for their experience with that court.

Good luck either way.
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What traffic court do you go to where you have to pay, or need a lawyer?
 
Cessnaflyer said:
What traffic court do you go to where you have to pay, or need a lawyer?
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You don't have to and that's my point. One of the other suggestions was to hire a lawyer for this purpose.

Now having said that, if you happen to know which lawyer in town is the prosecutor's golf buddy, he may get a more sympathetic ear.

My suggestion is really that if you don't want to hire a lawyer (unless I had some information on a specific one that could really help I wouldn't) this is a reasonable way to at least explore the possibility of a better outcome inexpensively taking a "nothing ventured, nothing gained" approach.
 
web265 said:
Now having said that, if you happen to know which lawyer in town is the prosecutor's golf buddy, he may get a more sympathetic ear.
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It's not even that complicated. The typical traffic law attorney is a bulk operation. While the riff-raff (that's you and me) wait in line or sit in court, they wisk in for an audiance with the prosecuting attorney. The prosecuting attorney whips out his rubber stamp and it's done, done, done for a stack of tickets. The judge signs off on it and the attorney pays the fines for his clients. The fine will be something more than what the ticket would have cost. That is why the court is so happy to close its eyes and stick out its hand. The lawyer charges for his role in this little bit of legalized bribery. The "offender" receives no points on his license or a moving violation on his record and everyone else walks away with the extra money he had to pay.
 
What you describe here happens for certain on a regular basis but without knowing the court in question, (not saying you don't, but I certainly don't) I wouldn't suggest that with such certainty.
 
Once again it has to do with suspensions or convictions. This is a traffic ticket not a suspension. Or revocation, part 2. Not sure what your getting at houston.
 
You need to be careful about taking it to court. Some courts won't let you do traffic school if you plead not guilty and loose. If you are guilty, which it sounds like you have already admitted, pay the fine, go to traffic school, and move on with life.
 
I'll start out by saying that you are certainly one of the most respected people on the forum and I'm not trying to imply anything by saying this.

But if I was on the hiring board (which I most definitely am not...still just an RJ gearslinger) and learned about this situation. I'd be much more apt to hire the guy who took his lickins, paid the ticket, and took responsibility for what happened than the guy who admits to doing it but just doesn't want to face the consequences.

I know all things considered you probably agree and I certainly don't expect everyone to agree with me. And again, I'm certainly not questioning your morality. Based simply off of what I've read on this forum I have nothing but respect.
 
North Carolina has something called Prayer for Judgement. Basically, if you don't have any offenses in the last three years, they will basically suspend judgement. If you go another three years without getting stopped, the ticket is dropped like it never happened. Get another ticket in the three years though, and you have to deal with both of them. You are on the hook for court costs though. Might look to see if Arkansas has this on the books.
 
mjmuel0 said:
Once again it has to do with suspensions or convictions. This is a traffic ticket not a suspension. Or revocation, part 2. Not sure what your getting at houston.
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ZapBrannigan had written:
I've heard that they may allow me to go to traffic school in exchange for removing it from my record.
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Then you wrote:

mjmuel0 said:
I'm pretty sure the above rule on medical is dui involved. NA I would say
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I posted a link to a legal case, which was a determination by the full NTSB that 18v does not just apply to DUI. That was this link:

http://jesseangell.com/forums/aopa_medical.pdf

The legal case has to do with a fellow who had suspensions of his driver's license that were not drug or alcohol related. So we can reasonably infer from that case that it doesn't just include those cases that are drug or alcohol related. So, let's look at the question stripped of its extraneous verbiage and see what it says:

18v. Yes / No - History of (1) .................... or (2) history of any ........................ which resulted in .............. or attendance at an educational ............ program.

Going to "traffic school" would reasonably be considered to be an "educational program".

The question does not just say "suspension or revocation".

My only issue with the court case is that 14 CFR 61.59(a)(1) says "Any fraudulent or intentionally false statement on any application". Had I been his attorney, I would have raised a much stronger defense that it was unintentional and that the fault, if any, lay with the FAA for not writing the question in a clearer manner.
 
Cptnchia said:
North Carolina has something called Prayer for Judgement. Basically, if you don't have any offenses in the last three years, they will basically suspend judgement. If you go another three years without getting stopped, the ticket is dropped like it never happened. Get another ticket in the three years though, and you have to deal with both of them. You are on the hook for court costs though. Might look to see if Arkansas has this on the books.
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That's actually a really good law. Everybody screws up from time to time, gives you a chance to try to do better.
 
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