Question on IFR XC requirements, part 61

fish1260

Well-Known Member
I have a couple of guys who are not your normal part 61 student. Foreign military trained, however they have no certificates or ratings from their previous experience, only their FAA PPL I just finished with them.

Their previous experience includes enough cross country time to satisfy all of the requirements, but my question is if this time would legitimately fulfill the requirements in the eyes of the FAA. For example much of their cross country PIC time was with another pilot or instructor aboard. They may have been acting as PIC, but they do not have a certificate and were not solo. Second question involves the long ifr XC. They have a flight that meets the requirements, but it was completed in a king air, while they are applying for a single engine instrument rating. Will class of airplane matter in this case? Local DPE seemed on the fence about it when I asked.

Thanks all!
 
They may have been acting as PIC, but they do not have a certificate and were not solo.
Then how were they PIC?

Second question involves the long ifr XC. They have a flight that meets the requirements, but it was completed in a king air, while they are applying for a single engine instrument rating. Will class of airplane matter in this case? Local DPE seemed on the fence about it when I asked.

Thanks all!
Instrument rating isn't class specific. It's "-Instrument Airplane", though you can get VFR limitations in a twin if you don't do an OEI approach...but that's a different thread. For the cross country, if it was done in an airplane it should be good.

-mini
 
Then how were they PIC?

-mini

That is exactly my point! They have no method to transfer their military qualifications into civilian licenses. I would imagine that their military training was far more intensive than what is needed for a private certificate here. However without that documentation they have me scratching my head on this one. There has to be some sort of precedent out there...anyone?
 
If they have the requirement met while in an aircraft with all the conditions of the FARs met (IE: night/with a CFI/etc) and it was done in the category of the certificate they seek then you are fine. Sit down with them with the FARs and make sure they meet the requirement word for word out of the FAR.

For example in the case of the

61.65 (D) (2) (iii)

For an instrument-airplane rating, instrument training on cross-country flight procedures specific to airplanes that inclues at least one cross-country flight in an airplane that is performed under IFR, and consists of -

(A) A distance of at least 250 nautical miles along airways or ATC-directed routing;
(B) An instrument approach at each airport; and
(C) Three different kinds of approaches with the use of navigation systems

I bolded airplane to indicate that they simply require it to be in the "airplane" category, so this should ease your DPEs mind. As for the rest go through 1 by 1, was it 250? Did he complete an approach at each airport? and Were there at least three different kinds of approaches? If all of that is yes then he is fine with 61.65 (d) (2) (iii) and you can check the others the same way.

Read the FARs as though you are back in high-school trying to be a smart-ass with your teacher, by this I mean take each word literally. If you take each word for it's literal meaning and any words that seem unfamiliar you reference to the definitions for the given Part then you will be able to decently understand this book.

Unless the requirement you check says it requires a class (there are non that I am familiar with but I am sure somewhere they exist) then as long as they were in an airplane it will count.

Good luck!
 
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