Question on CFI Initial Practical

troopernflight

troopernflight

Well-Known Member
I have a question for those who have been through the CFI initial practical in regards to FOI. When the examiner asked to teach any particular section, did they allow you to use a rough outline or lesson plan? I completed an outline for the entire Flight Instructor's Handbook, but I'm concerned that I won't be able to use it. I know the material pretty good, but I'm just worried I won't know where to start or that I'll miss certain vital topics for whatever section they want me to talk about. For example, will they just ask you "Tell me about the teaching process?", or will it be more circumstantial type questions? I know this will probably vary by examiner, but I was curious as to some the experiences you all have had. I've been signed off and waiting on the FAA to schedule the test. I can't wait to get this over with, I feel like I'm going to have an anxiety attack!
 
I'd say its going to depend largely upon the inspector you get. It's supposed to be a teaching test where you have access to resources. That said, FOI is not something you teach students so much as its your understanding of theory on how to teach... so needing an outline kinda suggests you dont understand the theory you are supposed to be applying.

My inspector wanted very little information about FOI, he wanted to see it applied. I think there were maybe one or two direct questions about the material, the rest was situational while teaching actual aero-material.

However, I've read of others where the inspector spend 1 hour plus just talking about FOI.

Sorry, it's just a very subjective test and each inspector has their own approach.

If there is an area that you really worry about being asked, I'd spend more time studying it and in particular for the FOI, have examples on how the concepts apply to real situations.
 
Ok, thanks. That's about what I figured, but I was just curious as to what some others have experienced. I believe I will do better if they have me present real life situations and apply the FOI to that. I hope I don't get one who just wants me to regurgitate info.
 
rframe said:
I'd say its going to depend largely upon the inspector you get. It's supposed to be a teaching test where you have access to resources. That said, FOI is not something you teach students so much as its your understanding of theory on how to teach... so needing an outline kinda suggests you dont understand the theory you are supposed to be applying.

My inspector wanted very little information about FOI, he wanted to see it applied. I think there were maybe one or two direct questions about the material, the rest was situational while teaching actual aero-material.

However, I've read of others where the inspector spend 1 hour plus just talking about FOI.

Sorry, it's just a very subjective test and each inspector has their own approach.

If there is an area that you really worry about being asked, I'd spend more time studying it and in particular for the FOI, have examples on how the concepts apply to real situations.
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Pretty much that. On the other hand, I had a series of "talking points" on each subject in the FOIs—that is to say, not "Lesson Plans", but notes. I glimpsed down at them from time to time to keep me "on point", and my examiner had no problem with that. He did comment that he didn't normally allow people to do a lot of reading for those questions, but he could tell that I was speaking extemporaneously and only glancing at my notes. Given some of the questions he asked, e.g. "What can you tell me about <FOI subject>", it would have been annoying (though not impossible) to try to speak only from memory without some single-word bullets to back me up.

That said, I've heard of inspectors dismissing any reference material out-of-hand on the FOI. I think I would have been ok without it, but I doubt I could have spoken as cohesively when asked to "Tell him about X". For the practical questions, it was no problem—and it shouldn't be, if you have a handle on the material.

~Fox
 
Congrats on the sign off and best of luck to you. I wish I could be more help, but as others have said it will vary largely by the examiner/inspector.

My inspector didn't allow me to use any references unless he told me to prove an answer, I wasn't even allowed to use my PTS and follow along. However, when we did the FOI it was discussion/teaching based. He would ask questions and I would teach and discuss them in practical use. We spent 2-2.5 hours on the FOI.
 
Acrofox said:
I had a series of "talking points" on each subject in the FOIs—that is to say, not "Lesson Plans", but notes. I glimpsed down at them from time to time to keep me "on point", and my examiner had no problem with that. He did comment that he didn't normally allow people to do a lot of reading for those questions, but he could tell that I was speaking extemporaneously and only glancing at my notes.
Click to expand...

This is exactly what happened with me as well.
 
troopernflight said:
I have a question for those who have been through the CFI initial practical in regards to FOI. When the examiner asked to teach any particular section, did they allow you to use a rough outline or lesson plan?
Click to expand...
Answering this specific question, I think it would be the very unusual examiner who would ask you to take on the role of an experienced senior CFI and give an FOI lesson to a simulated CFI candidate.
 
I asked this question at the start of my initial CFI, he basically said that he would expect a new CFI to have a binder full of lesson plans/outlines/etc. He wanted me to use it to make sure I covered everything, but not to just read it (without knowing the material fully) to him. The outline or "bullet points" allowed me to explain each one off the top of my head showing that I had the knowledge. For the FOI, I found the easiest way was to give an example of a particular situation.
 
Test is tomorrow, got assigned to a DPE in upstate SC. I've tried to not worry about it since I feel like I'm prepared, but I hope I don't have a bad day or do anything stupid that gets me busted. Everyone wish me luck, and hopefully I'll have some good news and a write up tomorrow evening. I'm going to try to just have some fun with it. It's still flying, which I love, right? (Sorry, giving myself a pep talk)
 
What I had to do, he picked two tasks out of the FOI section and tasked me exactly what was there. I couldn't use my notes for this part. I would say be able to answer every item in the PTS without notes and explain it. But to answer your question, every examiner is different. Just to be on the safe side go ahead and memorize it, I think I can repeat it verbatim now. Anyways good luck, you'll do fine

BTW I just got my CFI on Thursday
 
I passed! Very glad to have that over and to get that extremly heavy weight off my back. It still hasn't quite sunk in yet that I'm a CFI, but I'm ready to jump right in and get started with some students. Fortunately, a school in my area already told me they will use me part time, so I look forward to getting started with them ASAP. I used 2 airplanes for the check ride to save money, and the first portion on pattern work with the 172RG was a little ugly due to rough conditions, and a few brain lapses. But I knew what I did wrong and stated it to the examiner which I think let him know that I was just having a jittery start, though I knew what I was doing. The second half of flying in a DA20 went very well, and I redeemed myself during all the performance and ground ref maneuvers. Now I'm ready for a hot bath and relax with the fam. Thanks everyone for the advice!
 
troopernflight said:
I passed! Very glad to have that over and to get that extremly heavy weight off my back. It still hasn't quite sunk in yet that I'm a CFI, but I'm ready to jump right in and get started with some students. Fortunately, a school in my area already told me they will use me part time, so I look forward to getting started with them ASAP. I used 2 airplanes for the check ride to save money, and the first portion on pattern work with the 172RG was a little ugly due to rough conditions, and a few brain lapses. But I knew what I did wrong and stated it to the examiner which I think let him know that I was just having a jittery start, though I knew what I was doing. The second half of flying in a DA20 went very well, and I redeemed myself during all the performance and ground ref maneuvers. Now I'm ready for a hot bath and relax with the fam. Thanks everyone for the advice!
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Likelikelikelikelikelikelike. ^^

Congratulations. It ain't an easy checkride, to put it mildly. I'm very happy that you were able to make it through on your first shot... and congrats on having a place to work, too. :>

-Fox
 
Acrofox said:
Likelikelikelikelikelikelike. ^^

Congratulations. It ain't an easy checkride, to put it mildly. I'm very happy that you were able to make it through on your first shot... and congrats on having a place to work, too. :>

-Fox
Click to expand...

Agreed, it was not an easy checkride. If I remember correctly, I believe you recently got yours done within the past year, so I'm sure you still remember how much work goes into getting this completed. Not an easy task, by any means! It took me over a year to get it done. I need to add, I made it through on my first shot ..."by the skin of my teeth"! Thanks for the kind comments.
 
troopernflight said:
Agreed, it was not an easy checkride. If I remember correctly, I believe you recently got yours done within the past year, so I'm sure you still remember how much work goes into getting this completed. Not an easy task, by any means! It took me over a year to get it done. I need to add, I made it through on my first shot ..."by the skin of my teeth"! Thanks for the kind comments.
Click to expand...

Yep ... finished mine up in August. Oh yes.
 
troopernflight said:
I have a question for those who have been through the CFI initial practical in regards to FOI. When the examiner asked to teach any particular section, did they allow you to use a rough outline or lesson plan? I completed an outline for the entire Flight Instructor's Handbook, but I'm concerned that I won't be able to use it. I know the material pretty good, but I'm just worried I won't know where to start or that I'll miss certain vital topics for whatever section they want me to talk about. For example, will they just ask you "Tell me about the teaching process?", or will it be more circumstantial type questions? I know this will probably vary by examiner, but I was curious as to some the experiences you all have had. I've been signed off and waiting on the FAA to schedule the test. I can't wait to get this over with, I feel like I'm going to have an anxiety attack!
Click to expand...
By the way, what approach did you take here?
 
He did allow me to use the outline notes, but I ended up not even needing to refer to them. He asked me to talk about the Learning Process and Flight Instructor Responsibilities/Professionalism. After some talking on my part, he just said "Ok, you know this stuff, let's move on". I was so paranoid that I made sure I knew the material backwards and forwards. Always good to over prepare, especially for this ride. I actually wish I had spent more time studying some other things, but I didn't want to fail the oral first off, and I knew it would set the stage for the rest of the ride.
 
Congratz. It's much harder now than it was in the 80's. Best of luck to you. It's a license to learn, too. Jump into the part time gig with both feet. Ask you mentors or post here if you have any questions. Just give the student your best and you'll be fine.
 
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