Question about onboard radar

troopernflight

troopernflight

Well-Known Member
I heard that there have been instances where onboard radar didn't pick up a storm when it was picking up others in the same area. Does anyone know what would cause this and has anyone ever experienced this and inadvertantly flown into a storm? I know using onboard radar can sometimes be an art and experience with it is important. Any user tips or other wisdom to share in thunderstorm avoidance? On another note, I noticed that a storm scope is not a very good tool to pick through storms. What's the point of even using a storm scope when they seem to be so inaccurate?
 
troopernflight said:
I heard that there have been instances where onboard radar didn't pick up a storm when it was picking up others in the same area. Does anyone know what would cause this and has anyone ever experienced this and inadvertantly flown into a storm? I know using onboard radar can sometimes be an art and experience with it is important. Any user tips or other wisdom to share in thunderstorm avoidance? On another note, I noticed that a storm scope is not a very good tool to pick through storms. What's the point of even using a storm scope when they seem to be so inaccurate?
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Attenuation is pretty prevelent with onboard radar systems... That being, a storm can hide in the shadow of another one. Also, the radar depends on water bring present, so a building cell may not show up. The best way to pick through storms is still the good ole eyeball, assuming it's typical summer/frontal storms.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk
 
High-altitude tops often don't show returns (or very weak returns) because the particles are frozen. A good reason to keep your radar tilted slightly down, particularly when flying at night.
 
dasleben said:
High-altitude tops often don't show returns (or very weak returns) because the particles are frozen. A good reason to keep your radar tilted slightly down, particularly when flying at night.
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Or if you're talking with Milwaukee approach. We had something pop up on us about 5 miles ahead of us (no idea where it came from, we hadn't changed anything on the radar and it just popped up out of no where), and when we asked approach about it their response was, and I quote, "Oh yeah, we were just talking about that!"

Glad they took it upon themselves to talk with each other about it, but not us.
 
dasleben said:
High-altitude tops often don't show returns (or very weak returns) because the particles are frozen. A good reason to keep your radar tilted slightly down, particularly when flying at night.
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A nice trick I learned in the Caribbean was to turn the cockpit lights down on one side and have the guy stare out into the night... most times you can see pretty well as long as you aren't already in the weather... when in doubt ask for help.
 
Eyeballs are always the best thing, of course. :)

OP: Read some of the stuff Dave Gwinn (retired TWA captain, now deceased) has written about radar usage. I've learned a great deal about tilt management and basic radar theory from his articles and seminars. Radar Myths and Misconceptions is a good place to start, followed by Radar Tilt Management.
 
Interesting.

Maybe explains why a 747 deviates around a storm at 38,000 and an ERJ-145 drives right through it...

Always thought that never made sense
 
canadian_atc said:
Interesting.

Maybe explains why a 747 deviates around a storm at 38,000 and an ERJ-145 drives right through it...

Always thought that never made sense
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Could be any number of reasons, but a big 747 radar antenna picks up threats much easier than the ERJ's (which is downright awful).
 
FYI David worked for Honeywell as a consultant, and Honeywell has since changed some of their recommendations, specifically the altitudes to scan at - they've lowered them quite a bit.
 
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