Pipelines, Flows, Career Decisions, etc.

What would you do?

  • Stay at current regional, with B6 likely in 2 years.

  • Start over at AA Regional with bonuses and flow agreement advertised at 6 years.

Results are only viewable after voting.
Zidac said:
This is something I have been thinking about for a few months, and I'm looking for some opinions.
I'll get right to my situation...

I'm 31, 2 college degrees... (one from a 141 school, the other non-aviation related.) I'm a couple of months shy of 1500 TT.

I've been with a regional for 1 year and have a good chance at getting on with B6 in 2 years, through a pipeline program I am a part of.

Then again, a lateral move to an American wholly-owned carrier comes with bonuses and a (projected) flow to AA in ~ 6 years. I lose the B6 pathway if I go this route.

Getting out of the regional tier sooner would be great, but an AA flow is tempting, especially after flying with so many seemingly well-qualified CAs at my regional that can't seem to get a call. Thoughts? What would you do?
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I've said it any number of times, but I'll say it again. Evaluate a career move on its own merits, not on the vague chance that it might take you somewhere in the distant nebulous future.
 
All right, who voted for the AA flow?! Haha go to JetBlue, man. I would wager that this flow will be cut off by the time that you're projected to go. It's 10 - 13 years right now at Envoy.
 
BobDDuck said:
Actually it doesn't in this case. There is no language allowing for a flow down. Which is kind of ironic because there was no actual language for a flow up during the flow down J4J period.
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Which is absolute BS. If AA were to furlough the furloughees should be able to pick which wholly-owned to go to and only be junior to the lifers who bypassed the flow.
 
learhawkerbe400 said:
Which is absolute BS. If AA were to furlough the furloughees should be able to pick which wholly-owned to go to and only be junior to the lifers who bypassed the flow.
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As a guy who was subject mythical Flow Up contained in "LOA TBD" after years of J4J flow downs, all I can say is... sucks for you. Negotiate better next time.
 
Derg said:
I wouldn't choose a regional by virtue of who they have a flow with. My buddy knows some folks at American that are heavily considering phasing the program out.
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As much as id love that, I cant see it happening. The goal Is regional retention and I don't see what else they have or would do to retain, this is a big carrot.
 
Kingairer said:
As much as id love that,
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You get "at Brand X, we always kept our flight attendants"'d too? :)

I honestly have no idea, just parroting what my pal told me that's a little more than the average line Joe but maybe he's just engaging in wishful thinking.
 
Thanks for the insights and votes. Hypothetically, is this still the path most of you would take if you had 0 TPIC and a legacy is your ultimate goal?
 
av8tr1 said:
What do you mean by this?
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Bumping the retirement age to 67 would cause career stagnation and hurt younger pilots. Meanwhile guys that should have retired get to keep making money, yet their career progression was largely helped by mandatory retirements.


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BEEF SUPREME said:
Bumping the retirement age to 67 would cause career stagnation and hurt younger pilots. Meanwhile guys that should have retired get to keep making money, yet their career progression was largely helped by mandatory retirements.


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That is the stupidest thing I have ever heard. There are not enough pilots to fill the bottom ranks but you want to kick the most experienced pilots out because it gives the lower ranks that don't exist a chance to move up?

This is why I never want to go fly for the airlines. The union old farts at the top of the seniority list have created this lord of the flies work environment where everyone is ready to stab each other in the back to move up one notch in seniority. And the guys at the bottom eat it up every chance they get.
 
av8tr1 said:
That is the stupidest thing I have ever heard. There are not enough pilots to fill the bottom ranks but you want to kick the most experienced pilots out because it gives the lower ranks that don't exist a chance to move up?

This is why I never want to go fly for the airlines. The union old farts at the top of the seniority list have created this lord of the flies work environment where everyone is ready to stab each other in the back to move up one notch in seniority. And the guys at the bottom eat it up every chance they get.
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Suit yourself. I don't care.


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BEEF SUPREME said:
Suit yourself. I don't care.


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You should. One day you'll be 65 and wanting to keep your job while some punk kid is looking for every opportunity to stab you in the back to move up one notch in seniority.
 
av8tr1 said:
You should. One day you'll be 65 and wanting to keep your job while some punk kid is looking for every opportunity to stab you in the back to move up one notch in seniority.
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That's one way of looking at it....

Another is raising compensation to create more supply of pilots is good for everyone. Rather than artificially decreasing demand by keeping wages stagnant and increasing retirement age.


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BEEF SUPREME said:
That's one way of looking at it....

Another is raising compensation to create more supply of pilots is good for everyone. Rather than artificially decreasing demand by keeping wages stagnant and increasing retirement age.


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Why not do both? Compensation is already rising, We still don't have enough pilots to fill the bottom ranks. So keep the guys with the experience around a bit longer. But the fact is the industry needs to change fundamentally from lord of the flies to something different.
 
av8tr1 said:
That is the stupidest thing I have ever heard. There are not enough pilots to fill the bottom ranks but you want to kick the most experienced pilots out because it gives the lower ranks that don't exist a chance to move up?

This is why I never want to go fly for the airlines. The union old farts at the top of the seniority list have created this lord of the flies work environment where everyone is ready to stab each other in the back to move up one notch in seniority. And the guys at the bottom eat it up every chance they get.
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Yes, just like they did when they were junior. It's the way it works. Nothing has changed.
 
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