Pinnacle keeps delta...

kab32283

Well-Known Member
Heck ya! That's the kind of news I like to see!! :nana2:

My questions are:

1) Does this mean that guys like me swimming in the pool should expect a call with a class date soon?

2) Based upon the previous rumors regarding this whole delta thing, is a new TA in the near future?
 

Seggy

Well-Known Member
Even though I wish it was mainline flying, I am glad to see our parent company/sister airline grow. Pretty good news.
 

kellwolf

Piece of Trash
Heck ya! That's the kind of news I like to see!! :nana2:

My questions are:

1) Does this mean that guys like me swimming in the pool should expect a call with a class date soon?

2) Based upon the previous rumors regarding this whole delta thing, is a new TA in the near future?
1) Possibly. The other 7 -900s have been deferred until Jan-May of 09, so we're hiring for straight attrition right now. Guys have been getting SWA class dates like it's going out of style, so I'd imagine we'd see some movement. Last vacancy was canceled citing "we don't know what's going on with ATL" as the reason. Well, time to play catch up, I guess. Last time they canceled a vacancy we wound up paying millions to NWA b/c of lack of CAs.

2) No news of a TA yet. In fact, there haven't been any negotiations since earlier this month

On that note, Ken, wanna shoot me a run down of the P2P conference call last night? I didn't get a chance to sit in thanks to my fussy toddler. "NO I WANNA WATCH BACKYARDIGANS!!!!!!!"
 

SlumTodd_Millionaire

Most Hated Member
Gee, there's a surprise. :sarcasm: The flying was never in any danger. Just ridiculous posturing to keep the pilots in line, and from what I hear, it worked.

As for a TA, I heard from a couple of the union guys last week, and they say that scope is the only remaining stumbling block. The company won't budge, and the rest of the agreement is worthless without the scope.
 

kellwolf

Piece of Trash
As for a TA, I heard from a couple of the union guys last week, and they say that scope is the only remaining stumbling block. The company won't budge, and the rest of the agreement is worthless without the scope.

Unless the company has backed down on the PBS stuff they wanted, it's scope and PBS. The nasty combo of the two would make life hell no matter what pay rate they gave us. From what I heard from union channels, they want to up the ceiling the PBS solver uses to 105 hours a month and make min line values 80 hours. As long as they pay protect us on FAR issues (ie you go 30/7 you still get paid what you were supposed to fly), I think I would be okay with it. No pay protection, no go for me. You'll just wind up having your line value reduced WHEN you hit 30 in 7.
 

higney85

Property of Scheduling
Kell.. You are missing the real issue here with PBS. The P2P call is being rescheduled because SE wasn't able to call in the other night last minute. You will get your email from EM. We did "chit chat" and discussed PBS.. Without going in-depth on a public forum:crazy: I will show the big issue by a hypothetical...


"Company PBS"- build lines to a min of 85 hours CREDIT and a max of 105 hours (currently the numbers are 75-95).

This doesn't sound "bad" when it involves efficient trip with the usual high block times but more of the "soft money" that we currently do not have. Truth is this is not where the block vs. credit 10 hour difference lies. The issue is the company wants to be able to have vacation, training events, etc added to a line IN ADDITION to the regular flying schedule where your credit can get over 100 hours (105) but block is still FAR compliant (30 in 7 as well as 100 block in a month).

Here is an example of how the company's proposal would "get ya".

Lets say that in this example for "august" you have a week of vacation. In July you held 17 days off and worked a 3 day a week schedule with weekends and had a credit of roughly 90 hours (this would be VERY common for FO's who are here in their second year and are getting their first full week of vacation). This month you have your vacation so you would "expect" 10 days of so off total around your vacation and at least 20+ off for the month. Well.. the min days off would be 11 and your "schedule" would give you off your week and give you roughly 20 hours of credit, but now it would build you 85 hours of flying in the last 3 weeks which would now be 3 4-day trips to do that- preferences out the window! So you would have only the first week (nothing more) and then work a 4 on/3 off schedule for the rest of the month. 11 days off min only applies to an entire eligible month, since you are on "Vacation" the first week your days available are pro-rated. Now you are stuck with 9 days off in the last 3 weeks and only have 16-18 days off for the entire month COUNTING your vacation. Back to the original example you are not getting any more days off for the entire month and the last 3 weeks would "suck" compared to your usual 3-day trip each week. This example has your credit up over 100 hours, covers the usual month's flying for a line pilot, AND gives you your vacation- but in reality the pilot got the shaft for his vacation.

I know some are "sceptical" about this example, but this would be quite common and there would even be people with training events each month in addition to vacation that are credit only and would chew even more into days off.

Just think about it and it should be obvious why the union is saying "no" and the company is trying to push it to say "you make MORE money".

Plus.. BIGGEST ISSUE FOR ME: PBS (section 25/scheduling) was already TA'd and now the company wants to go back and reopen...:banghead:
 

kellwolf

Piece of Trash
Yeah, I had heard the section was TA'd. To me, that means they agreed upon it. Sorry, no going back. That's like signing the contract and then wanting to re-negotiate it a month later.

I hadn't heard that about training/vacation, and yeah, that's a deal breaker for me, too. It's sorta the way PBS is working now. As in if you have training or vacation for the month, you pretty much KNOW your schedule is gonna be screwed.
 

higney85

Property of Scheduling
I had vacation in June for my wedding and was able to be off the first 16 days. Then I was blasted the last half the month with 60+ hours in the last 2.5 weeks and most of my preferences that I always get went out the window. I bid for 3-days typically and normally have 4 3-day trips and a trip that has a day or two or carry in/out. I ended up with a grand total of 21 days(3-5 more than normal), now with the slides back it is worse than the buffers. Frustrating.
 

kellwolf

Piece of Trash
Yeah, I'd rather have the VAB days than the slides. It's less confusing and you can actually plan on those days. I think the only reason they went after the vacation slide so hard is b/c the company was gonna take buffer days away. I'd like to see VABs in the next contract rather than slides, but I think I'm outnumbered.

Wonder if you had tried the "load schedule at the beginning of the month" option if it woulda helped. Probably not. Honestly, I think it has to do with how PBS thinks when it comes to line construction. The whole thing where it assumes people would rather be on reserve than hold a high speed line is bass ackwards, too.
 
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