Serious over reliance on automation!
Pilot deliberately crashed his airliner....unbelievable!!
- Thread starter J777Fly
- Start date
SeanD
Well-Known Member
Regarding Egypt Air.
There doesnt seem to be any sort of attempt to pull the guy out of the seat and beat his ass 10 different ways for trying to crash the plane. They would have had plenty of time to do so. Instead the captain and him were fighting over the control column and it doesnt seem the captain said anything that would insinuate he was crazy and out of control and to hand over control immediately. At least that's what I gathered from the CVR transcript.
ScorpionStinger
Well-Known Member
Was reading the article.... It doesn't say what kind aircraft. Most reporting say they type airplane involved, not just flight number.
z987k
Well-Known Member
Second link says it was an E190.
HVYMETALDRVR
Well-Known Member
Intentionally crashed airliners.
Probably the G forces were unimaginable. Would have been almost impossible to pull the FOR out of his seat during the maneuver. And the captain did ask the FO if he shut down the engines. The relief first officer also asked the operating FO to switch unusually early in the flight. Then the captain excused himself from the cockpit. That's when everything happened. To suggest that some type of catastrophic failure happened as soon as
the relief FO was left alone is stretching a
bit.
ScorpionStinger
Well-Known Member
Thanks I see it now. Much appreciated
dustoff17
Still trying to reach the Top Shelf
I thought this very thing as I read the article. I must be getting old....
I can still remember a day when you pushed the stick, the trees got bigger and when you pulled back, they got smaller. Now we have computers that we program so that it can verify this fact before the plane makes a move. And another computer that moves the controls and throttle (except Asiana, that one is still in question) for us. Not only that, we have another computer that screams at us as we get closer to the ground. All this automation is making it harder and harder to bend metal.....
Oh well, I guess I have to adjust or move on to something else.......
soakingpilot
Well-Known Member
If anyone is depressed/suicidal, there is confidential help available. Don't fly and seek help!!
Actually having flown down in Botswana the past two years I can almost guarantee there is 0 counseling going on... About 7 years or so ago one of the Air Botswana Captains stole an ATR flew it around Gabarone the capitol for a few hours because he had lost his job ( various speculation as to why that was ) and then flew it into the rest of the fleet including few atr's. He only killed himself fortunately. The unfortunate part was that Air Bots was finally just making it into the black and since has just been loosing money left and right. Shame
Wasn't it speculated that the Skywest guy was going to do the same with the RJ not too long ago?
soakingpilot
Well-Known Member
I will say though that this is in my view is just another part of the industry that's taxing on the soul. The second anything goes wrong with either equip or the pilot things get blown way out of proportion Not saying that this isn't serious but even when a plane does a go around, the media hears about it and sends a news crew to JFK.
Obviously this instance and the RJ and others listed here are more than non-normal.
Double shame.
Gonzo
Well-Known Member
ChasenSFO
hen teaser
He destroyed all 3 of the airlines almost brand new ATR-42s in that accident. I read that someone in the tower was negotiating with him and they had actually thought he was going to come around and land before he did the unthinkable.
Well, remember, the CA was fighting gravity somehow pulling himself back into the cockpit. Even when he got there, and yes the CVR is vague, one can gather the CA didn't have time to consider the unthinkable, and instead may have just thought the F/O was trying to recover but messing it up. I agree the CA didn't sound like he was in a life or death struggle with the F/O, but investigators thought it was amazing he even made it back to the cockpit, so we can assume wrestling the F/O and taking control was easier said then done. IIRC, he took the left seat and desperately tried to take the yoke asking the F/O "Pull with me!". That hinted that the F/O was fighting the CA's attempt to bring the nose back up. From the evidence I have seen, I think the investigators had a solid case for pilot suicide. I know the Egyptian one's still disagree.
stuckingfk
Well-Known Member
This happened to a newer UND airplane many years ago.
http://www.ntsb.gov/aviationquery/brief.aspx?ev_id=20001212X22111&key=1
Apparently the pilot had just received a second DUI within that week of renting the airplane, so decided to check out. Reading the narrative with RAP ATCT was somewhat chilling.
http://www.ntsb.gov/aviationquery/brief.aspx?ev_id=20001212X22111&key=1
Apparently the pilot had just received a second DUI within that week of renting the airplane, so decided to check out. Reading the narrative with RAP ATCT was somewhat chilling.
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Dugie8
Well-Known Member
My MEI instructor at the time.
That was my fault. I saw the drinking problem and did nothing to stop it. Had I had bigger balls I would have slapped some sense into him, this wouldn't have happened.
It's not your fault. I had a co-worker commit suicide that I considered a pretty good friend and it's very easy to 'look back' and connect things that didn't really connect all that well until the event happened.
I know a lot of folks that may have alcohol problems and 'challenges' are just a normal part of adulthood, but the combination of both, in most people, doesn't result in someone doing ultimate harm to themselves.
Not your fault.
Unfortunately, an ERAU instructor beat this guy to it in Florida 4 years earlier. So his death wasn't original, if that matters. In fact, damn near the same.
http://www.ntsb.gov/aviationquery/brief2.aspx?ev_id=20001211X11123&ntsbno=MIA98FA239&akey=1
ChasenSFO
hen teaser
If you search for suicide in the NTSB database, it's chilling how many accidents come up. I read one years ago where a father was having custody issues with his very young daughter, he took he flying and then nosed into a house on final. Some terrible stuff.