PD down to...

Almost everybody I hear check on says "with you." My usual check on is "CompanyCallsign 123, Maintaining XXXX Thousand," or "CompanyCallsign 123, XXXX Climbing/Descending XXXX," but center is so used to "with you" that there are plenty of times when I hear, "uh, was that you checking on?"
 
I never even noticed people saying "with you" until it came up on the boards. Now it's like nails on a chalkboard!
 
dasleben said:
I never even noticed people saying "with you" until it came up on the boards. Now it's like nails on a chalkboard!
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Agreed. I thought I sounded like the big boys when I would use that phrase. Then my commercial examiner beat that out of me with some snide remark and I think of him every time I check in. Took care of that issue. Except the spine tingling of the chalkboard when someone else says it.
 
boondr said:
It's the same for PD as any descent, you're supposed to notify us when vacating a previously assigned altitude. I would say maybe 20% at most of pilots do it. I don't really care either way, but it is a nice reminder that descent was given.
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Considering how vague things are, here's where I'll make it confusing:

FAR 91.183 (a) "except that while the aircraft is under radar control, only the passing of those reporting points specifically requested by ATC need be reported."
This is the only thing I can find in the FARs that comes close to this subject, and it can be interpreted that, while in a radar environment, I don't have to report that altitude change when I wait 10 minutes to start down.

Then we have AIM 5-3-3 (a) (1) (a) "When vacating any previously assigned altitude or flight level for a newly assigned altitude or flight level." Pretty specific, but then we start the back-and-forth about FAR vs AIM. Also, 5-3-3 starts out saying that these reports "should" (not must) be made at all times.

Plenty of room for interpretation and interpolation, if you so choose. So, bottom line, how do the controllers generally feel about it? I've never heard anyone say "Airliner 123, I need you to write down this number for not telling me that you're vacating an altitude." Yet.
 
dasleben said:
I never even noticed people saying "with you" until it came up on the boards. Now it's like nails on a chalkboard!
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Same here...it would slip out every once in a while...then after I read about it on here I started making that extra conscience effort not to say it.
 
"ABC Center, Airplane 12345, level XXXXX"

I never used to care about "with you" until someone pointed it out. Now it's annoying.
 
Douglas said:
We all know that a pilots needs to notify a controller when leaving an assigned altitude but what about when they give you P.D. down to a lower altitude.

example: if I'm at 9,000 and you give me P.D. down to 4,000, but I want to wait 10 minutes until starting my descent, do I need to notify you I'm leaving 9,000 ten minutes later when I start down?

It just seems like a place of limbo.
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Great question. That has always been a place of uncertainty for me. I just always say when I'm leaving an altitude just so they see I'm doing it. I don't want to vacate and they don't notice it right away. I know it's unlikely, but things could get messy pretty quick.
 
*sip of coffee, check watch

LateWhaleFreight 469 leaving Three One Zero descending One Zero, ten, thousand

Every time with a PD, sometimes it's even more than 10 minutes.....
 
"Plenty of room for interpretation and interpolation, if you so choose. So, bottom line, how do the controllers generally feel about it? I've never heard anyone say "Airliner 123, I need you to write down this number for not telling me that you're vacating an altitude." Yet.[/QUOTE]


I want and am expecting the report leaving an altitude, even if it is 10 minutes later.

As far as the scraping on the chalk board "We're with you", you will probably get a quick lesson in ATC comunication from me and then most likely you will get to try it again. It usually goes something like this, "King Air 12K, we're with you is not in the book. When you check in you need to check in with your call sign, altitude leaving and your assigned altitude. Now lets try that initial call again."
 
AUATC said:
As far as the scraping on the chalk board "We're with you", you will probably get a quick lesson in ATC comunication from me and then most likely you will get to try it again. It usually goes something like this, "King Air 12K, we're with you is not in the book. When you check in you need to check in with your call sign, altitude leaving and your assigned altitude. Now lets try that initial call again."
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No lie?
 
AUATC said:
"Plenty of room for interpretation and interpolation, if you so choose. So, bottom line, how do the controllers generally feel about it? I've never heard anyone say "Airliner 123, I need you to write down this number for not telling me that you're vacating an altitude." Yet


I want and am expecting the report leaving an altitude, even if it is 10 minutes later.

As far as the scraping on the chalk board "We're with you", you will probably get a quick lesson in ATC comunication from me and then most likely you will get to try it again. It usually goes something like this, "King Air 12K, we're with you is not in the book. When you check in you need to check in with your call sign, altitude leaving and your assigned altitude. Now lets try that initial call again."
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Wow talk about stepping way out of the lines with your power. Your're not the fiz-do, nor the pilots mom and certainly not a CFI when behind a scope, so take a chill pill. If you have time to correct every minor deviation from strict phraseology you are 1)working an extremely slow facility so you have time for that BS; and 2)completely misdirected in your priorities.
 
boondr said:
Wow talk about stepping way out of the lines with your power. Your're not the fiz-do, nor the pilots mom and certainly not a CFI when behind a scope, so take a chill pill. If you have time to correct every minor deviation from strict phraseology you are 1)working an extremely slow facility so you have time for that BS; and 2)completely misdirected in your priorities.
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I had a controller get an attitude with me much like the above (I moved the airplane in a non-movement area without talking to him). I told him I wasn't going to argue with him on the frequency, but that I was ready to copy the phone number for the air traffic supervisor. That request ended the issue real fast.

Goes both ways! (Of course, I can't issue penalty vectors or write out controller deviations ;))
 
I would just make a sarcastic response...something like "With me? Well of course you're "with me". You're on my frequency aren't you? Fly heading 320, vector for spacing"
 
boondr said:
Wow talk about stepping way out of the lines with your power. Your're not the fiz-do, nor the pilots mom and certainly not a CFI when behind a scope, so take a chill pill. If you have time to correct every minor deviation from strict phraseology you are 1)working an extremely slow facility so you have time for that BS; and 2)completely misdirected in your priorities.
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There are only a small handful of people that I work with that get all in a knot about pilot phraseology. Most, myself included, really only care that the readback is correct, and that any communication is concise and to the point. I don't think there is anything that annoys anyone more than a VFR wanting flight following that gives all their information, plus half of their life history on the initial call.

Personally, I think having a pilot announce when they're vacating an altitude when in radar contact is a bit redundant.
 
dasleben said:
Well that hardly helps these days. If I do any BWI flying I expect direct 50W, and make it snappy.

(Standing by for penalty vectors)
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Well this is all noted,

Next time I have a 57/67 out of BWI direct 50w there's gonna be a scenic tour of Canadian airspace ;)
 
ppragman said:
Almost everybody I hear check on says "with you." My usual check on is "CompanyCallsign 123, Maintaining XXXX Thousand," or "CompanyCallsign 123, XXXX Climbing/Descending XXXX," but center is so used to "with you" that there are plenty of times when I hear, "uh, was that you checking on?"
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Sad thing is many of the instructors at the ATC Academy say and teach "with you" on initial call. So waves of new controllers are coming who are expecting it! I tried to snuff it in my class; we'll see.
 
canadian_atc said:
Well this is all noted,

Next time I have a 57/67 out of BWI direct 50w there's gonna be a scenic tour of Canadian airspace ;)
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Yea the last few nights I have had to knock washington center down a notch with their directs. We have had anything from direct SOMAX (a landfall fix way over in Europe) to direct any fix that is just before a coordinate. They have no idea where they are sending these flights. Direct BOBTU from ORF is not good. Where do you work canadian_atc?
 
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