One of those days in the sim

ZapBrannigan

ZapBrannigan

If it ain’t a Boeing, I’m not going. No choice.
So I'm at recurrent. This is probably around my 30th recurrent, but my 15th at this company and my 6th in this airplane.

Been flying for 25 years. Been doing it for a living for 17. (and a few years as CFI before that)

Today was day 1 of a 4 day recurrent at FSI. Just had the WORST day I have ever had in a simulator. It wasn't for lack of preparation, I studied and felt well prepared. I just screwed up... then screwed up again... and after that it was like a snowball effect.

My partner flew first. After a break we got back in and I reprogrammed the FMS for the second leg. I failed, however, to remove the departure airport from the FIRST leg from the route. So we took off on an RNAV departure... and the FMS immediately commanded a turn in the wrong direction. There were easily 3 or 4 places I should have caught that before we pushed up the power for takeoff.

Ouch... ok, let's put it behind us and move on. During an unusual attitude recovery I typically scan all 3 instruments before I make any control inputs to recover. The instructor announced, "Your controls" and I glanced at all 3 instruments... and all three of them agreed!

Ok, so that tells me that my PFD is accurate right? I look at my PFD and recover from the nose low, left bank attitude. Nothing happens. Airspeed increasing, thrust at idle, spoilers extend... nothing. He freezes the sim. We rolled THREE times. He failed the AHRS on my side AFTER I had control of the airplane. ACK! Ok, so now I feel like a circus clown trying to earn a PPL. I am embarrassed and ashamed.

Not to belabor the point. Next I screwed up an LNAV approach to an MDA to a missed approach, followed by a passable raw data ILS.

I post this for two reasons. First, pilots don't like to admit mistakes. We love to tell stories about how we saved the day, but its pretty rare to hear a pilot say, "Hey, that was totally my fault, and I screwed up."

I want the low timers who read this forum to know that it doesn't matter how long you have been doing this, or how many hours you have, you can still have a bad day in the simulator. I'm no Lindbergh -- that much is for sure -- but I sure like to do the best I can and today I didn't do that. You can be darned sure I'll be better prepared tomorrow.

I hope... lol
 
Sounds like he was making your 15th recurrent with the company a little more interesting, I know my company does, non-jeopardy of course. They know you can fly the airplane at this point, otherwise you wouldn't have been around so long. They're giving the work around, come back tomorrow, whoop the sims ass, and remind them and yourself why they gave you an opportunity so many years ago (old man). :)
 
ZapBrannigan said:
Today was day 1 of a 4 day recurrent at FSI.
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I'm curious what your thoughts are on FSI. I've only ever been involved in the airline world and you know how that works with recurrent and sims. However I've had several friends that fly corporate tell me how nasty their FSI instructor was or other various complaints. I was surprised because I feel like when paying a contractor like FSI to help with training, they should make every effort to be accommodating, friendly, and at least cordial towards the students. But on the other hand I suppose they have to be sure their training is good since they are sending people out in unknown flight ops environments. But unfriendliness isn't the best way. Thoughts?
 
I've never met a FlightSafety employee who was "unfriendly" -- after all, in the corporate world you are their client and they have to earn your business lest you decide to go to the competition. On the contrary I've seen FSI let a client get away with stuff that, in the 121 world might have been a failure or require retraining. They tend to debrief, "Great job guys! See you tomorrow!" rather than giving you the cold, hard truth that you need.

That said, I think that the training is every bit as professional as the airlines and I like the format i/e morning groundschool followed by afternoon sim for four full days. AQP was pretty new to 121 when I left the airlines and I really thought it was amazing. This is very similar to how I remember that being.
 
ZapBrannigan said:
Today was day 1 of a 4 day recurrent at FSI. Just had the WORST day I have ever had in a simulator. It wasn't for lack of preparation, I studied and felt well prepared. I just screwed up... then screwed up again... and after that it was like a snowball effect.
Click to expand...

Snowball effects happen.....better in sim than in the airplane. Everyone has a bad day.

My partner flew first. After a break we got back in and I reprogrammed the FMS for the second leg. I failed, however, to remove the departure airport from the FIRST leg from the route. So we took off on an RNAV departure... and the FMS immediately commanded a turn in the wrong direction. There were easily 3 or 4 places I should have caught that before we pushed up the power for takeoff.
Click to expand...

But you caught it when it happened and didn't turn where the FMS commanded you to? Or are you autopilot-on at this point?

Ouch... ok, let's put it behind us and move on. During an unusual attitude recovery I typically scan all 3 instruments before I make any control inputs to recover. The instructor announced, "Your controls" and I glanced at all 3 instruments... and all three of them agreed!

Ok, so that tells me that my PFD is accurate right? I look at my PFD and recover from the nose low, left bank attitude. Nothing happens. Airspeed increasing, thrust at idle, spoilers extend... nothing. He freezes the sim. We rolled THREE times. He failed the AHRS on my side AFTER I had control of the airplane. ACK! Ok, so now I feel like a circus clown trying to earn a PPL. I am embarrassed and ashamed.
Click to expand...

The Lear is a pretty maneuverable jet for a business jet....at least that what I got out of my only flight ever in a -23.

So you kind of reacted too quickly when you were given the airplane? Oh well, good place to do it is in the sim.....as well as the acro. :)

Not to belabor the point. Next I screwed up an LNAV approach to an MDA to a missed approach, followed by a passable raw data ILS.
Click to expand...

At least he didn't give you a back course PAR. Or the HI-ILS to ROW.

I post this for two reasons. First, pilots don't like to admit mistakes. We love to tell stories about how we saved the day, but its pretty rare to hear a pilot say, "Hey, that was totally my fault, and I screwed up."

I want the low timers who read this forum to know that it doesn't matter how long you have been doing this, or how many hours you have, you can still have a bad day in the simulator. I'm no Lindbergh -- that much is for sure -- but I sure like to do the best I can and today I didn't do that. You can be darned sure I'll be better prepared tomorrow.

I hope... lol
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Good stuff you posted here Zap. Don't know if my commentary does anything to make you feel any better, as it's intended to; but in all seriousness, we all screw up things any number of times and at any given time, whether student or longtime ATP. We learn from it and press on, and like you say here, everyone should be readily able to admit it.
 
MikeD said:
you caught it when it happened and didn't turn where the FMS commanded you to? Or are you autopilot-on at this point?
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No, I caught it as soon as it started to turn the wrong way and asked for a vector. In the real world that would have been a carpet dance at the very least, and more likely a violation.

MikeD said:
So you kind of reacted too quickly when you were given the airplane?
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Not really. I did pause, look at all three sets of instruments before I began the recovery. At that moment, all three were in agreement! Where I failed, was not RE-cross-checking the other instruments when the airplane wasn't responding to the control inputs. I so convinced myself that my PFD was correct, that it didn't even occur to me that that could be the problem once the recovery didn't go like it should. Bad juju.

MikeD said:
At least he didn't give you a back course PAR. Or the HI-ILS to ROW.
Click to expand...

Dude, I don't even know what those are. Is there a book in the Smithsonian or something? lol
 
Great thread. Seriously. Good reminder that experienced, well-trained people can make deadly mistakes in the air. Thanks for sharing your experiences honestly.
 
Everyone had their bad days, especially in the sim every now and again.

Dan208B Ive been to FSI at ICT and ATL and I have never met an rude or un-friendly person there. Everyone Ive worked with has been very professional and great to work with.
 
I just finished day one at recurrent here in MCO. First time in a Level B full motion Sim. Got like every failure today possible I think, all night, IMC, approaches to minimums, ice, traffic, turbulence. Almost lost it once, Trying to do a missed approach, stupid flight director wouldnt connect to "nav" mode. It stayed in "go-around" mode, and thats when the EFIS kicks the bucket. I felt like I was a student pilot learning how to keep the plane upright.
 
Dan208B said:
I'm curious what your thoughts are on FSI. I've only ever been involved in the airline world and you know how that works with recurrent and sims. However I've had several friends that fly corporate tell me how nasty their FSI instructor was or other various complaints. I was surprised because I feel like when paying a contractor like FSI to help with training, they should make every effort to be accommodating, friendly, and at least cordial towards the students. But on the other hand I suppose they have to be sure their training is good since they are sending people out in unknown flight ops environments. But unfriendliness isn't the best way. Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Agreed with the other follow-up post to this. If anything FSI and the like can be a little too friendly and forgiving. I've seen things that are downright scary and make you wonder how the guy has made it as long as he has.

I can see getting nervous and botching some things. But, there are a few that really make you wonder, and they usually end up leaving with certificate/appropriate training paperwork in hand.
 
Hey we have had all less than stellar day in the box. Learn from it and move on. I think it is pretty crappy of FSI to fail the AHRS during the recovery, seems like a compound failure to me. I have had E170 training under 121 and found it to be great training and great staff. I have a friend that took a Hawker 800 type ride and they made it last all freaking day in the box.
 
Going through instrument training I do not think there is a flight that I do not make a mistake on. Especially those flights with five different approaches to three different airports within 15 nautical miles from each other. Now that I have burned through my VA money to the exact allowance for end of course and a check ride, the weather has canceled my recent attempts to finish up the rating. Now I feel like everyday I wait, the more nervous I get about making mistakes during the EOC flight which is with the assistant chief instructor. Thanks for sharing your story with us!
 
ZapBrannigan said:
So I'm at recurrent. This is probably around my 30th recurrent, but my 15th at this company and my 6th in this airplane.

Been flying for 25 years. Been doing it for a living for 17. (and a few years as CFI before that)

Today was day 1 of a 4 day recurrent at FSI. Just had the WORST day I have ever had in a simulator. It wasn't for lack of preparation, I studied and felt well prepared. I just screwed up... then screwed up again... and after that it was like a snowball effect.

My partner flew first. After a break we got back in and I reprogrammed the FMS for the second leg. I failed, however, to remove the departure airport from the FIRST leg from the route. So we took off on an RNAV departure... and the FMS immediately commanded a turn in the wrong direction. There were easily 3 or 4 places I should have caught that before we pushed up the power for takeoff.

Ouch... ok, let's put it behind us and move on. During an unusual attitude recovery I typically scan all 3 instruments before I make any control inputs to recover. The instructor announced, "Your controls" and I glanced at all 3 instruments... and all three of them agreed!

Ok, so that tells me that my PFD is accurate right? I look at my PFD and recover from the nose low, left bank attitude. Nothing happens. Airspeed increasing, thrust at idle, spoilers extend... nothing. He freezes the sim. We rolled THREE times. He failed the AHRS on my side AFTER I had control of the airplane. ACK! Ok, so now I feel like a circus clown trying to earn a PPL. I am embarrassed and ashamed.

Not to belabor the point. Next I screwed up an LNAV approach to an MDA to a missed approach, followed by a passable raw data ILS.

I post this for two reasons. First, pilots don't like to admit mistakes. We love to tell stories about how we saved the day, but its pretty rare to hear a pilot say, "Hey, that was totally my fault, and I screwed up."

I want the low timers who read this forum to know that it doesn't matter how long you have been doing this, or how many hours you have, you can still have a bad day in the simulator. I'm no Lindbergh -- that much is for sure -- but I sure like to do the best I can and today I didn't do that. You can be darned sure I'll be better prepared tomorrow.

I hope... lol
Click to expand...

Wheeeeeeeew! I am glad to see that even the real professinals do this too!
 
After 6000 ish hours of 121 time and a healthy amount of days in the SIM, I still usually find the SIM to be a higher stress environment than actual flying WHEN things are going wrong. There's something about having your job and records in some level of jeopardy. It makes my palms sweat like I'm back in high school, on a first date with Wendy Pfeffercorn (What movie?). :)

I've had moments like that too. You prep like hell and then still have remedial moments once you get in the box. Lately I am finding that getting several nights of solid sleep before SIM really helps keep the extra stupidity at bay.
 
ZapBrannigan said:
So I'm at recurrent. This is probably around my 30th recurrent, but my 15th at this company and my 6th in this airplane.

Been flying for 25 years. Been doing it for a living for 17. (and a few years as CFI before that)

Today was day 1 of a 4 day recurrent at FSI. Just had the WORST day I have ever had in a simulator. It wasn't for lack of preparation, I studied and felt well prepared. I just screwed up... then screwed up again... and after that it was like a snowball effect.
Click to expand...
Um, who do you fly for again? ;)
 
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